Why I dislike Planetary Annihilation

Discussion in 'Planetary Annihilation General Discussion' started by hallis68, May 1, 2014.

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  1. hallis68

    hallis68 New Member

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    Supreme Commander is one of my favorite games, and there are some things that makes me certain I will not enjoy PA as I did supcom.

    To me supcom was all about the epicness, seeing gigantic armies clash together, colossal robots stomping around and powerful defensive position that would consist of large shield domes that would take something really powerful to break through. So when I learned that both shields and experimentals (maybe my two favorite things in supcom), would not be included in planetary annihilation I instantly lost almost ALL interest, and I wholeheartedly disagree with the claims that these does not contribute to the gameplay.

    I believe I heard someone quote a developer that said experimentals would make normal units useless, to which I must ask; when have you EVER seen a supcom game that only had experimentals? Of course they are stronger than other units for the same total cost, but they take a looong time to build, and during that time you are very vurnerable to attacks. And even if you do get it out, the enemy might have scouted it already and built corresponding units to counter it in good time.

    Back to the shields, perhaps they might not work very well with this game, but even if it doesn't I believe that when you take this out of the game, you should at least introduce something that could replace the visual "coolness" of having them there. Don't take the epicness away without replacing it! And yes I know you have these cool orbital weapons and all that, but to me that is not something I would consider part of the battlefield, which is why I belive PA currently lacks that feeling.

    So to conclude, the reason I don't like this game is that it lacks the visual epicness of supreme commander. In that game I was thrilled about the thought of getting out an experimental every game, and nuking to me was the "lame" way to win (since lategame weapons in PA to me seem like they're all different versions of nukes). And one last thing I would like to see changed is the gigantic UI that covers the map, some units cant be seen over its large hovering icong even though you're really zoomed in!

    What do you guys think, it may be better gameplay wise, but visually? The game has such a nice graphics style too, it's such a shame that you never get to see anything of it, at least that has been the case in all the videos I've seen so far.
    (Sorry if my spelling is not perfect)
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  2. Nicb1

    Nicb1 Post Master General

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    Even though I quite like PA, I'm in a similar position to you where I miss those epic features like the massive experementals that were present in supcom and to a lesser extent shield domes. There was a megabot thread posted a while ago in the backers lounge, but due to a very vocal group of people it is unlikely that megabots/experimentals will be present in pa's future (although one can hope). The excuse that some people make is that the game just becomes a race to the experimental tier if they are included (Although I find this argument lacking and close minded). Shield domes were a cool feature of supcom in my opinion but they are not as big a deal for me as the inclusion of experimental units.

    I do sincerely hate it when people say this, but in the end people like us are just going to have to hope that someone decides to mod these things in.
    lordhog, lynxnz, Dr4gonBender and 6 others like this.
  3. cptconundrum

    cptconundrum Post Master General

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    I'm not sure what you want us to say, You seem to have done your research into the game and made a decision on it already, so I don't think you posted here looking for someone to try to change your mind. Likewise, the decision to not use shields or experimentals is pretty well established and not likely to change, so your post was probably not a request to change the game. By your tone, you're clearly sincere and intelligent, which means you aren't just trolling.

    So I guess the post was just written as a review by a fan of the genre. My request to people with a negative opinion of the game is usually the same; just wait a bit longer until the game is released before you judge it too harshly. It's not finished yet and some of the design choices (like no experimentals) might seem better to you once the balance gets worked out. You may of course still be disappointed, but I think judging the game now is just too early.

    If you really do end up disliking the game for balance and unit choices, you will still be able to enjoy the mods that might turn it into the game you want with the same planet-smashing engine we have now!
  4. Gorbles

    Gorbles Post Master General

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    PA isn't SupCom.

    I've said this about PA not being TA, and it also applies here.

    There are a lot of things PA has that SupCom lacks. That doesn't make SupCom "lame" or somesuch by comparison.
    corruptai and thelordofthenoobs like this.
  5. BulletMagnet

    BulletMagnet Post Master General

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    Someone needs to show OP that 9minute Monkeylord.

    Experimentals were expensive, but not expensive enough. And if you got them, they concentrated so much firepower into one package that they could kill every smaller unit before the unit had a chance to do some good.

    I think the problem can be summarised like this;

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  6. drz1

    drz1 Post Master General

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    and again, by the sounds of it, a lot of modders are keen to create SupCom3 using the PA engine, so I would imagine your wish would come true eventually. Personally, I like where it is heading without experimentals and shields etc.
    corruptai and Gorbles like this.
  7. hallis68

    hallis68 New Member

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    Well, at least I'm glad to hear that these things might be possible with mods. I still think they should add something to compensate the emptiness I and perhaps others feel around the missing experimentals and such. Even if it's not the same game it clearly is a spirtual successor, as supcom was to TA. I really do think that they should be careful in removing things that a lot of people liked without introducing something else in its place. This is how it has been with most successors of things I liked that failed in the past; they removed something, introduced something else, but they added something that didn't replace the stuff that they removed.

    I don't really consider the crashing of planets and such something that can replace these things either, to me those features just feel like one of the game enders in supreme commander. But lets put the discussion about what game is better aside for now, what I really want is to see if you people agree that it would be better if they added something like this. Are you guys just making yourself satisfied enough with the new features to not whine about it missing experimentals and some other things, or do you truly believe that they could not add these kind of things without ruining the game? Personally I am sure that they would be able to add something which satisfies the lust for something big and destructive, but I think it depends on us to show that we actually want it. Which again is what I am unsure about; you guys would want this too, right?
  8. tatsujb

    tatsujb Post Master General

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  9. cptconundrum

    cptconundrum Post Master General

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    I think they could make it work. with just one race, everything can be balanced. The question I would have is whether it is really more fun to build smaller defensive areas and a few experimentals than a couple thousand cheap disposable units. From tatsu's post, I can see that shields are something they're not doing because they think they can spend the time and money better on something else. I respect that choice and I'm not even disappointed because we have so much more, but I do agree that they can be cool if done right.
  10. thepilot

    thepilot Well-Known Member

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    Since then, FA had 2 years of balancing, it's not possible or viable anymore. T3 bots are actually way than XPs. XPs are meant to be used inside an existing army, not anymore like an one-man army.
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  11. hallis68

    hallis68 New Member

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    Well I think the actual balancing of the unit itself is not important to think about at this point, it could just be made the right price, or maybe it could take longer to build. I really still disagree with experimentals as a concept being overpowered no matter what, because if it takes long enough to build, the defenses of those who build it should be weak enough to penetrate if the enemy notices it. If they don't notice that they enemy is building it because they didn't scout, or if the enemy simply managed to pretend that they were not vurnerable to attack. Whatever the reason, I think the idea of making yourself weaker for a period of time to then be avarded with something really powerful is a thrilling concept, making it balanced should not be impossible at all.
  12. cptconundrum

    cptconundrum Post Master General

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    I should try FaF again at some point. To be honest, the main thing that turned me off from playing FaF is something that is already happening in PA too; by the time I got around to trying it, everyone was already so much better than me.
  13. thepilot

    thepilot Well-Known Member

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    Also the same for shields. They are broken in supcom, they are fixed now.

    The problem was that you could stack them and make a un-penetrable layer of protection.

    Now, shields that are stacked are sharing the damage, so you can't do that anymore.

    People who dislike XPs & Shields because of their experience of supcom vanilla should realize that they are getting their opinions based on a 7 years old balance (looks how much have changed in PA balance in a year...).
    Time has passed, all is way better now.
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  14. tatsujb

    tatsujb Post Master General

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    now you have personal tutors from the very best players, and such a wide player base that it's impossible for you not to encounter at least 100 people with your exact skill level at any given time.

    plus everyone is so outgoing and willing to take the time to teach. all you have to do is ask.
  15. thepilot

    thepilot Well-Known Member

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    We have a lot of new players, so it would be weird that you don't find some people your level to play with :)
  16. cptconundrum

    cptconundrum Post Master General

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    You underestimate how bad I was at that game. :D
  17. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    except for factory HQ´s that piss me off to no end ...
    but well that´s just me
  18. tatsujb

    tatsujb Post Master General

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    YOU underestimate how bad of a player I've encountered. look up THE_FENIX, I bet you my second screen you can't loose to him ^^
  19. thepilot

    thepilot Well-Known Member

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    You don't have to use it if you don't like them. There is an option in the lobby to disable them, and they are made in a way that they are not better than doing it the old way (engy assisting).
  20. hallis68

    hallis68 New Member

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    Yeah and isn't that what a strategy game is about? Someone prefer defensive strategies, turtling up with tons of shields and heavy artillery, some like me love going for big stuff at the expense of being vurnerable and weak otherwise. The point is that I think they shouldn't cast aside one part of the community who loves doing those things they don't believe fit in the game, instead, they should add something for those people to enjoy.
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