Stopping to enrage raging people.

Discussion in 'PA: TITANS: General Discussion' started by cola_colin, August 21, 2015.

  1. mutrumbo

    mutrumbo Member

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    On the plus side, the Steam forum seems to be a bit less bad today than it was yesterday. Only
    Here's another reference:
    link
  2. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    I don't think there is any need to track that.
    Yes you can find people in the steam forums that twist any word they see in whatever way they want. ;)
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  3. mutrumbo

    mutrumbo Member

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    Ok, ok. :p
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  4. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    op won´t change my personal stand ..
    yes it sucks to people who paid a larger ammount ... yes KS backers got titans for free .. it just happened ... nothing to be done about it ..
    if uber were to give it free to any PA owner they may likely hurt themeselfes financialy ...
    the thing is people have to understand and accept timing .. they buyed into the game knowing the risks .. at least one assumes .. it was their decision .. if they can not understand and accept that .. there is nothing to be done .. they will vent their frustration off other people will try to explain or ignore and the non ks- owners either calm down or continue to be pissed ..
    there isn´t much choice to this .. it has nothing to do with what is better than the other .. it simply happened that KS was timewise where it mattered the most yet that doesn´t mean it made later investments worthless or less worth ..
  5. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    Ironically, aside from some posts outright insulting the developers, the most toxic posts are from those 'defending' them. I had an absolutely delightful conversation with Woolfoma, who jumped straight on in there and started personally attacking people off the bat.

    [​IMG]

    Betrayal is a strong word, and I use it full well knowing that, it is a word which easily summarizes how most people against this feel. Who's place is it to tell others how to feel? Obviously enough people feel strongly about this to cause quite a fuss.

    Actually Colin is of the same mind set as me on the matter, he's made his view clear previously. You can try to counter argue if you wish, but I don't see a rational argument as to why people who paid $20 should be given something for free while those who paid $90 should be expected to pay for it. That's not a rational thing to do.

    As I mentioned in a previous post here, the reason a lot of people react like that is due to being told things along the lines of "you should feel glad" etc etc. People are angry, the last thing they want is others talking down to them, which is precisely what they have had from the start.

    I've tried to remain optimistic on the matter of the devs, I would sincerely like to hope this was a naive slip up, but the way in which it fits together does make for some damning conspiracies with varying levels of believabvility.
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  6. Morloc

    Morloc New Member

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    Just wanted to clarify a point I've seen crop up a few times.

    EA backers were not necessarily paying to get the game earlier, or buying a game which was already playable.

    The KS campaign ended on 09/14/2012
    I purchased the game on 11/30/2012

    Alpha did not begin until 06/08/2013. There was no playable game when I bought the game.

    There were in fact EA tiers we could buy in at, and I upgraded (again, prior to any playable game) to one where yes, I did get game perks including the Alpha, Delta, Theta, and Progenitor commanders.

    I've heard it argued that the KS backers were taking a risk or whatnot, yet "If the project falls short, no one is charged. Funding on Kickstarter is all-or-nothing."


    None of this means anything, but did want to clarify those misconceptions.


    also..

    Thanks colin for casting a reasonable tone for this thread to build on.

    -Morloc
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  7. nizoox

    nizoox New Member

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    You simply will not understand that the EA ppl not want that ALL PA owner get a copy free or? Precisely because of such comments from you the discussions will never end.
  8. Gorbles

    Gorbles Post Master General

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    @Elate:

    Your personal experience, absolutely fine. I'm drawing from my own.

    My own involves pages and pages of Steam Discussion forums debate, and I'm very confident that the stats will side with my conclusion on it. It sucks that people are addressing you in such a way, but obviously without context we can't see the full picture. And certainly, "idiots" is by far from the strongest phrase I've seen used.

    What don't you understand about the Kickstarter vs. EA argument? Colin has asked us not to go down that rabbit hole, so feel free to PM me. I won't spend time on it here.

    You're here talking about conspiracies, and how you're justified to your emotions.

    So are we. Neither party is "wrong" for expressing them.
  9. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    oh i heard varring degrees from all PA owners to EA owners to all people who supported PA in some way or the other .. it still doesn´t matter .. uber decided to give it only to KS-people .. everyone else get´s the discount .. weither you like it or not .. there simply isn´t much else to say about it .. it´s just shoulda, woulda, coulda ... i also find it funny of how you accuse me of
    "you will not understand ... EVA!" .. yes i am THAT stubborn .. cause reasons ..

    i gave my critique to it as well already .. i said titans should be a seperate addon while having it additionaly as goldpack, i said it should be a 75% discount instead of 66% as that fits with the price difference between the two .. heck i personaly wouldn´t even have a problem to pay the 10 bucks extra for the addon if i had to ..

    what else do you want from me ... just shut up and let them vent off their frustration at anyone? that doesn´t help no one either .. and even if it were discounted for absolutly everyone people would still be pissed about it no matter what ..

    it´s like no matter what uber does it loses in some way .. you will have always someone who get´s pissed at them ..
    what do you do about that? help them, explain stuff or ignore them and move on ...

    i am rather the guy that trys to explain stuff as it seems to be than let people gravel in their anger pissing of others unneccesarily ..
    Last edited: August 21, 2015
  10. dreadnought808

    dreadnought808 Member

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    Agreeing.

    Also: Yes it's only 13$. But it's the principle.
    I'm refusing to buy the Elite expansion, not because it's only the full price of a new game, but out of principle.

    Seriously though... The newly improved PA, even without Titans addon, is friggin' beautiful.
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  11. dreadnought808

    dreadnought808 Member

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    <claps>
    Lots of good comments here!
    As a general rule, people are stupid. I have found that many of the successful kickstarters either focused on a higher intelligence audience (I'm thinking Kerbal) or explained everything carefully and in easy language (I'm thinking prison Architect or StoneHearth)
    In order for Kickstarter to avoid shitstorms over nothing all the time, one must be careful with transparency. Clearly show, possibly in videos, what's being done and why and keep it simple. Don't show stuff people won't get. Update frequently. Make no promises and stick to those you do make.
    The crowd is fickle; kickstarter introduces them much earlier on in the product and thus must be catered to from that moment. Neglect it, and the proverbial **** hits the fan.
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  12. DarkGift

    DarkGift New Member

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    First thought: Nice post Colin. Give yourself the Internet Empathy Award of the Day.

    Second thought: Under "Damned if you do, damned if you don't" there must be a picture of the Uber crew pulling out their hair and shedding tears. My heart goes out to them.

    Final thought: Life is short. Time is your ultimate resource. Would you rather be raging about this for hours on end on the forums or actually playing the game? I get where the EA people are coming from (I'm one of them, though I didn't pay $90. Honestly, don't remember how much.) But at the end of the day, we got years of "free" support/patches and Uber is a business. $13 is nothing and until we see them giving away their old Ferraris, I'm not really worried about them being some "money grubbing evil empire" out to screw their fans. They're probably just worried about how they're going to continue to make payroll and do what they love for a living. In the end, they had to draw the line somewhere and it wasn't going to please everyone.

    Now I'm taking my own advice and going back to playing Titans. :)
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  13. mwreynolds

    mwreynolds Well-Known Member

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  14. Geers

    Geers Post Master General

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    It's reliable enough for a rough estimate.
  15. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    If we're assuming that all those 44k free games have been redeemed, that's 7k sales. That doesn't seem like a whole lot for something that is, by steam anyway, considered a new release.
  16. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    Considering that the backers free games don't make any income and titans has been playing ping pong with the steam sales top 10 I'd guess that there have been more than 7k sales for sure.
  17. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    Can we get a source as to whether giving out keys doesn't go towards top sales? Cause I find it really hard to believe that it could reach top sellers within hours of it launching and only have 1.5k people playing it. Especially considering how quickly it has fallen off the top sellers, unsurprisingly like there was a sudden peak and then it just fell, which would be consistent with 44k people sudden getting the game and then sales just dropping off.

    In short, I'm not sure what metric top sales goes off. Whether it's amount of people who own the game in a given time frame, or actual sales. (I'd imagine it was the former to take into account retail sales and redemption on steam.)
  18. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    I don't know either, but I don't see why it would not quickly reach top 10. It's still like #11 or so. Nothing unusual when a game is released and thousands of people click "buy".
  19. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    Generally speaking though, those kinda games stay in the top 10 for at least a week or so. Titans is dropping off rapidly.
  20. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    How so? I think the best rank was 3 or something. It bounced between 3 and 6 or so for a day and now it around 10, sometimes in top 10, sometimes barely not. Not seeing it dropping.
    The scale isn't exactly reliable as well. Maybe titans is constantly selling X copies, but other games have peaks, etc.
    There simple is no reliable data we could use to tell how successful it actually is at this point.

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