Stopping to enrage raging people.

Discussion in 'PA: TITANS: General Discussion' started by cola_colin, August 21, 2015.

  1. perfectdark

    perfectdark Active Member

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    Seriously though guys, take the criticism on the chin, and move on.

    Start up the livestreams again, or consider recording a vlog and get somebody GOOD to edit it.
  2. scottjames

    scottjames Member

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    At my age i don't rage about much and frankly i get tired of see and hearing raging. BUT!! it was advertised to all those kickstarters and those with early access what their benefits would be. In other words that's false advertisement. Uber needs to make good on all those who supported this game. Period. This is no argument or raging. I'm just stating facts.:cool:
  3. squishypon3

    squishypon3 Post Master General

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    Early access and Kickstarter got their benefits. Nowhere did it say that the Early access tier will be the same as the Kickstart tier... In fact I think I may be able to find a dev mention how they aren't the same!

    For example the 90$ KS tier got the Alpha commander and Progenitor, EA at 90$ did not. Nor did beta at 50 - 60$ get progenitor when the KS backers did.

    The reason the two were never the same is because Steam's early access isn't allowed to have tiers and such like KS, so it was just paying more money to get in earlier.
  4. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    Let's not delve into that argument in a thread about not delving into that argument.
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  5. walmartdialup

    walmartdialup Active Member

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    True, but this is also true.



    EA buyers want to believe even if it isn't true. I am an EA buyer and I want to believe that I helped make PA! EA policy doesnt say this is true, but I don't care. So yes, as Colin was describing in his OP, lets thank EA buyers for supporting PA.
    squishypon3 and cdrkf like this.
  6. cdrkf

    cdrkf Post Master General

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    I agree that people should get what is advertised. I think the confusion (and cause of much of the issues) is a misunderstanding over exactly what *was* advertised and to whom'.

    I was a Kickstarter backer, I've followed PA from the beginning, and as far as I can personally tell what was sold to me during the pitch is what I'd received, and well before the Titans update.

    Without seeing the sales page presented to the EA backers on Steam I can't assess if they have missed out on something they should have got or not, however many of the things people claim the game lacks are more based on assumptions than facts. Either that or people use very broad strokes and under defined terms to make a point like 'feel' and so on, which you can never really argue for or against. What I 'feel' about a game is purely subjective and may be totally different to someone else.

    TL:DR, I agree with you everyone should stick to the facts rather than all the raging. I also think if someone can clearly demonstrate a situation that they haven't received something they clearly should have then Uber will rectify the situation (they really are a decent group from my experience).
  7. squishypon3

    squishypon3 Post Master General

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    Hehe, I'm an EA buyer myself, I know I helped with the development because I've been here and active in the community- Lots of silly balance mods too. =)
    PhoneySpring646 and cdrkf like this.
  8. popededi

    popededi Well-Known Member

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    It is a very sad situation people are whipping up here, and Colin is right about counter-raging not being beneficial to anybody.

    I personally don't believe anyone has anything to moan about, but that's beside the point.

    Uber can say things that would help the situation for some, and then there's the trolls who won't stop at anything, who do this because they are having fun/it's their only way to feel power/they're cray.

    All we can do is try to help, and write good honest reviews, and up and downvote appropriately to try to fix this. Further aggravating people won't be helpful to anybody.
    cdrkf likes this.
  9. Uke

    Uke New Member

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    Accurate.

    This. I mean why would I want to play an unfinished game?

    Thanks for understanding!
    cdrkf likes this.
  10. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    Well good to see it's not a complete circle jerk around here, I mean as much as I'm getting paid to hat- I MEAN.

    In seriousness, you hit the point on the head. Most of us feel betrayed at this action, it's not a case of money, I spend more than this on cosmetics and heroes for Heroes of the Storm, because I'm a dirty, dirty casual. We feel slighted that our contribution is seen as less important.

    People are also agitated and suspicious about the whole decision to remove the original game. Not because they have a problem with the standalone concept as people claim, but that they feel it was made entirely to hide the negative reviews, some of which are deserved. For the record before this mess I had a positive review on it, but I think a lot of the negative points, while out dated, were important. I for one want to know the development history before I buy a game, it doesn't really take a lot to look at the date and see whether it's still an issue.

    Formal apology, admittance of screwing up, a word from Uber on the matter at all. An olive branch of any kind is better than silence.

    And it's stuff like this, that causes the problem.

    Telling people who are angry about being charged money for whatever reason that they should be grateful for the opportunity is like telling someone with massive debt that they should be grateful they aren't being charged higher interest. DOESN'T REALLY WORK THAT WAY.
  11. cdrkf

    cdrkf Post Master General

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    Fair comments, I think the devs have been commenting on some things, whilst I think in the specific issue of early access vs KS getting a free copy I think they're waiting a little for the dust to settle (tensions were running high at launch, maybe it's not a bad idea to let things calm down a tad before wading in?).

    I certainly don't think there was any mal intent towards the EA crowd, rather a good intent towards the Kickstarter community.

    As for removing PA, maybe they should have left it up and offered an upgrade to titans for anyone who purchased PA (could have priced the two so it costs the same either way?). I personally think it's fair enough Titans gets a second chance at review though, as a large % of the negative reviews were about things that simply aren't applicable anymore. I mean I don't think the game should be marked down for things like 'no save / load' or 'no offline' when both features are in and fully working, so from that perspective making Titans a standalone makes sense to me.

    I think at the end of the day, Uber are a great team of engineers and game designers, maybe not the best ever at PR as others have noted. Hopefully they'll do something to address all the legitimate concerns in the near future once everything has settled down a bit.
  12. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    I don't disagree, but as I've said, the cynic in me wonders whether they're waiting to see if they can get away with it or not. I can't remember for certain but didn't Jables mention they were watching what was happening just not responding?

    I don't think there was malicious intent, but it does show how they view the two communities. Unintentionally, but still.

    That's another point of contention in itself. You can get PA for dirt cheap from any number of sites now due to the numerous sales and bundles. Forcing people to now buy it bundled with the DLC at full price again is a rather under handed move. Perhaps those previous sales were a mistake, but I don't think this was the way to go about solving that.

    In terms of reviews, that's an issue with Steam, I'm of the mind set that EA reviews shouldn't apply to the games rating once it reaches release.

    They've had quite a lot of PR blunders that's for certain.
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  13. mutrumbo

    mutrumbo Member

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    @cola_colin

    Were you aware that some people in the Steam forums are taking this comment seriously?

    link1

    link2


    link3
    I think we need to be more careful about what we write to ensure people don't misunderstand.
  14. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    I don't see any serious comments.
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  15. mutrumbo

    mutrumbo Member

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    oO
  16. cola_colin

    cola_colin Moderator Alumni

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    People who are arguing on the level of "you're hired to defend Uber" aren't really people I want to talk with.
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  17. mutrumbo

    mutrumbo Member

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    Oh, no, I agree. I don't have any intention of diving into that forum either, but I think it would be wise to limit the amount of potentially misunderstandable material as possible. You know? Why give them more ammo to fire at Uber?
    bradaz85 likes this.
  18. Elate

    Elate Active Member

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    You were obviously paid off by Uber to say that.
  19. Matster

    Matster Active Member

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    You know out of all this shitstorm I kind of like that Titans has at least moderately increased the number of PA players which now hovers around 700 a day with ups and downs.
  20. Gorbles

    Gorbles Post Master General

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    You can feel something, but that feeling isn't necessarily rational or even based on the truth of the matter. The same goes for everyone. There are only so many comments of "**** off you developer shill" you can endure before your own language gets out of hand in response, that's human nature.

    "betrayal" is a very strong word that evokes both personal harm and strong reactions. By using such language, you open yourself to strong responses.

    @cola_colin is telling us who are defending Uber, to take a step back and not deliberately fan the flames, or act like Early Access supporters' grievances are illegitimate out of hand. This is perfectly reasonable. Especially considering the vitriol we are also experiencing when sticking up for the developers.

    He is not saying that everything you say is a fact and you should from hereonin expect no counterarguments to your declarations.

    There are most definitely two sides to every story. But we can't have a reasoned debate about your grievances if you're not open to the idea that your grievances might be flawed. Just as you can't have a reasoned debate with us if we assume the developers are saints that can do no wrong.

    I, personally, have been trying my damnest to not assume the developers are saints. They're only human. But any attempt at infusing a level of rationality into most of the Steam threads, or some of the complaint threads on here, has been met with immediate and outright hostility.
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