PTE build 79270-pte now up

Some misc bugs with the latest patch:
Advanced torpedo launchers (and probably basic ones) did not auto target nearby underwater dox.
AI seemed pretty dumb with their commanders on a mostly water random map... One sat on an island for most of the game while I shot it to death. It really was Absurd... Not to mention with 3 other planets (and AI presence on all of them), nobody thought it was a good idea to leave the planet. Perhaps due to the new reluctance to use Astraeus, and the fact that the starting planet was 80% water... Will edit in replay ID when it becomes available.

Edit 1: Still no replay ID... those sure do take a while to show up. Anchors built over enemy buildings do not attack them unless directly ordered to or area attack ordered. There were a few odd instances where infernos would drive by enemy buildings and not fire for a few seconds, then figure themselves out. Their turret rotation speed isn't like super low, is it?

It wouldn't make it effortless to build up on a planet undetected. Good players would send radar satellites to scout the other planets, but currently bad players can effortlessly detect you by simply building one Deep Space Radar. You could compare it to building a T1 ground radar and gaining full vision of the whole planet you are on, but it's even worse than that. Currently the DSR gives you full orbital vision of every single planet. That's just stupid. Just like you have to use skitters and firefly's to scout your planet, you should be using radar satellites to scout other planets. If you are stupid enough to allow SSX snipes then you aren't playing the game right. So many people are noobs and they comment on balance when they don't even know how to play the game properly. I'm not calling you a noob, but people who get SSX sniped have lost the game already. You won't see me getting SSX sniped. And anyway keeping the DSR the way it is currently is not the correct way to balance a unit. If they think the SSX is too powerful after the DSR changes then they should look at other methods to balance the SSX, eg. Possibly reduce the cost of arkyds, make them orbital layer scouts only and give them more HP, just one example. Or alternatively create a new orbital scout unit.

I think the best way to prevent SXX snipes being easy would be to adjust their strength relative to umbrellas (can you drop one SXX over one umbrella and win?) and to prevent them from stacking up; that way, you need several to survive the umbrellas, and 50 can't converge on the same point at once. I think this may be at least partially in already. The other thing is, anchors are also pretty effective defenses against SXX's, and you can easily position some combat fabs out of range of the splash, since it takes more shots and longer between shots than in previous builds already.

As far as "having already lost if you get SXX sniped"... I disagree heartily. SXX is the perfect way for an under-ecod player to come back against a player with a massive eco advantage, but poor preparation. The ability to stage surprising comebacks is one of my favorite parts of Planetary Annihilation, so I don't think we should nerf SXX snipes into oblivion. Just don't let it be too easy.

You just explained why they got SSX sniped, "poor preparation". Having the best Eco in this game isn't the only way to win in this game and neither should it be. As I said, that guy had already lost long before getting SSX sniped. Maybe we should actually buff the DSR so that it detects all nuke launchers on every planet too, because the guy with the better Eco might be unprepared and hasn't built any anti-nukes, LOL. You guys are looking at this from the perspective of people who like to Turtle up. Learn to play the game, as I said you'll never see me getting SSX sniped. People don't know how to play the game and they just want to be able to play Sim City while not scouting or attacking... well sorry you are going to lose against good players if you play that way and keeping the DSR the way it is isn't going to help you in the end anyway.

There is one change which does need to be implemented though. The Umbrellas need to prioritise the SSX because currently I can bring in a load of Avengers to use as cannon fodder and no amount of umbrellas are going to protect you.

LOL.

You guys.

The SXX is easily beaten by an umbrella in a 1v1 in the stable build.

If you put up 5-6 Umbrellas, you don't really have to worry about ANYTHING. You can literally kiss the idea of a SXX goodbye, unless he has 20-30 of them.

Umbrellas are OP.

But they have to be in this build, because otherwise orbital would rule with the cheap SXX. Orbital is still bad - and it needs an OP umbrella to keep it balanced.

Having similar issues with the AI and planet generation as a lot of other folks - planets are still generating with what looks to be at least 70% water at most times. I've been mostly playing on large asymmetrical planets.

The AI seems a bit reluctant to venture off world lately, often leaving their commander in their original base for the whole game. Still kicks my butt though...

@Planktum
If you're arguing that the game should be balanced so that players have to scout planets with radar satellites, then you're kind of contradicting your own argument that it should be easier to set up a base on a distant planet undetected.

You see, the way it is currently, people scout less because the Deepspace Radar does a good enough job, and that's precisely what makes it possible to set up a stealth base as long as you don't go orbital in it. Nerf the Deepspace Radar, and suddely you'll have radar satellites swarming on every planet in the system - and those see the ground layer as well.

I never said it should be easy to set up a base on a distant planet undetected (please show me where I supposedly said this). You should be able to be scouted out, but the fact that one Deep Space Radar gives away your position because you decided to build orbital units is just stupid. You will find most people on these forums agree with me and that is the reason Uber are fixing the DSR. You won't have radar sattelites swarming on every planet because they consume energy and it would be better to balance the radar satellites (by tweaking build time, cost, etc) than keeping the DSR as it is now. And as I mentioned before, we should have orbital scouts (whether these are the current radar sattelites or a totally new unit), just like we have the Firefly and Skitter for ground based scouting.

Actually I'm surprised no one else uses this as an opening. I pretty much have been opening every game I play with build bot factory, queue up assist factory, priority queue some fabbers, infinite build dox, have the factory patrol planet, then micro in energy plants after the first fabber is done. It works well when the fabbers auto assist right as they come off the assembly line, making it much easier to make the plants, radar, and mex right off the bat...

Main problem not in umbrella. Problem is that "orbital wars" working not good now.

Yes 1 umbrella can kill 1 SSX easily. But SSX looking really OP in "late" game. Enemy with 3000 metal economy should just find your commander.He can send like 50 avengers+8 SSX and its enough for comm snipe. Even 5-6 umbrellas can't stop this comm snipe.

I really think that we are need in commander's invisibility.It should work only when comm stands on site and not shooting.Maybe with 100k energy draw.

After this we can:

1) reduce umbrella's rate of fire but give them fire priority vs SSX.
2) Increase SSX's HP and vision radius

We need to stop trying to fix the current system. Any further buffs to the already OP umbrella will just make orbital fights ridiculous. Especially late game, where I routinely spam out umbrellas all over planets to protect from intel and Unit Cannon drops.

This whole issue is moot if you add in a railgun that puts avengers on the bottom of any orbital priority list. That's not even taking into account the Capitals from Orbital Warfare Overhaul either - just the railgun would be an ok fix.

But, as I've said elsewhere, we need the whole package. That mod is beautiful and it should be seriously considered for an implementation into vanilla.

Problem is mostly how units arive after interplanetary transfer. It's this pinpoint accuracy which allows them to fire instantly on arrival which makes balancing so broken. Proper insertion maneuvers where they would have to "fly in" instead of appearing out of thin air would already solve that issue. (And a bunch of other exploits such als the invulnerable commander in Astreus-exploit as well.)

Unfortunately, this mechanic is here to stay. It has many pros and cons, but it's better than the issues that the alternatives present.

That said, Celestial Radar not being God-like would really help nerf the power of this maneuver by leaving you blind to a planet you haven't seen yet.

I kinda wanna say make the avengers be built from the air factories, then have a much stronger AOE type craft built from the orbital, that way you can spam air factories and get SOME sort of mobile defense against those freaking annoying orbital fabbers placing anchors in uncomfortable places. That way you can get an orbital presence early but the design of that orbital fighter from the factory should hopefully prevent spam of avengers

Spam orbital factories. It's the same thing.

The SXX/Umbrella sniping balance was perfect the way it was when you could see SXX being built and prepare adequately. All it takes is to move the commander through a teleport when you see the SXX moving out. The SXX should be powerful, the Umbrella is overpowered enough as it is. The countermeasure should be to evacuate, not turtle in and watch SXX fall like flies.

But when you can't see the SXXes coming, that's when things get out of whack. Suddenly sniping is either too easy or too hard depending on how strong Umbrellas are.

In order to balance the laser satellite first they should increase the commander health (make the commander tanky). Make snipes harder to pull off. Currently the game has quite a big focus on commander snipes, which I do like, but this could be balanced a little more but making snipes harder to pull off by certain weapons. Secondly they could add some sort of anti-laser satellite jammer type unit (it should be relatively expensive too), just like we have the anti-nuke. This would counter the laser sattelite but it wouldn't be able to kill any orbital units. So it's not going to shut down the invasion but it would stop these insta-kills on the commander. Balance always needs a paper scissors rock mechanic, and then the focus is on scouting and intel gathering.

orbital mines? either explosive or EMP style. invisible to radar, but can be seen by radar sat LOS

AA turret bug, not shooting at air.