No motivation to build turrets

I've had it happen in too many games now that there's just no motivation for us to build turrets at all. Any turrets that are ever built get destroyed almost as soon as they're built, and this applied to both sides simultaneously. The games just resulted in a marathon of player and bot killing. I find myself switching from Support to Assassin in such a scenario, making myself escape the lockdown scenario to just keep us from losing. It doesn't matter how many turrets or players the other side kills as long as no bots get in to bring down the shield.
I've heard the developers want players to put more emphasis on turrets, but there's really far more motivation to just be a devastating threat yourself. At the same time, I really don't think there's any solution to it. Any solutions I see just destabalize other things too much. I realize this is entirely a personal problem, but just wanted to vent about it. For a tower defense-style game, there seems to be too much motivation to follow the idea of "the best defense is a good offense."

there is a few ideas. multiple supports who know what they are doing is the easiest, as the devs dont have to worry about it then.

the next few are being implemented already, as a competent support can defend against anything but a juice rush, and juice should be rarer after the update.

the only other thing you could do is slightly boost all turrets health by 50%. this should be fair.

All that's changing with juice (from what I recall reading, anyway) is that juice stations get cooldown, which will be basically meaningless unless it's on the same level as the Annihilator. Besides, destruction of bots & players will supply all the juice they need naturally. Just ask anyone who's been hit by juice within the first minute or two of the game. As for turret health, this just makes Support better, when Uber is clearly doing everything they can to nerf the class.

I feel your pain. I've been saying this for a long time. Juice ends up killing turrets so fast that it's not even worth building them. I stopped building them a long time ago, and it works well for me.

okay. how about changing the armor type for the turrets, where it just withstands more damage without having a health bar actually increased. meaning the heal gun doesnt earn any more heal than it already gets because it heals the same amount, but the hurt gun, mortars, ect, will do 50% less damage

or make the heal gun effect turrets better.

or just stop juicers. people will eventually need to defend themselves against juicers.

Another thing to take into account is the endless health recharge juice bug that I see at least twice in every game I play. This makes risk/reward for rushing down 3.3 Pew Pews incredibly lopsided. Said 3.3 Pew Pew should be putting a modicum of hurt upon any class that tries to juice and take it down at close range, but as it stands, I'm seeing people flee the scene with full health. When this issue is finally fixed and gone for good, turrets will have a bit of an indirect buff (notice I called going back to the way things should be an "indirect buff").

I build turrets every game. Yes, they can be taken out easily, but level 3 LaserBlazers are cheap, quick to build, and if they keep a juiced assassin occupied for a fraction of a second allowing me to boot her off of the edge then I'd say it's worth it.

If you didn't have those turrets there, then the juice would be used to wipe out your team and potentially allow bots to move in to the base, costing the game. Turrets ensure than non-juiced players won't be walking through your base, and at least slow down juiced players.

If my team has at least one intelligent support, I will build turrets.

Problem with turrets is that they need to be babysat. I build turrets before I leave to go push bots, I overheal everything in the base. But by the time I come back/respawn most of them are smoking stumps. Leaving me with the knowledge my money was squandered. And who normally destroys said turret? 90% of the time it's a juiced assassin. At least in my experience.

Hence why money is better spent on skills/spawning bots/juice.
3 Lasers blazers level 3 costs $525 That money is usually better spent on juice/skills.

Turrets are a passive threat, a pro with skills is an active threat.
Active>Passive

Skills are permanent, turrets are not.

I think it really goes without saying that Crossfire should really be oriented around offense rather than defense. The easier it is for a team to defend their base(excluding the spawn ring I'll say), the easier it is to end up in a stalemate. Who likes stalemates now?

What could be done that would change this? I can't think of a good way to change it that wouldn't result in yet MORE of Monday Night Team Deathmatch or promote stalemates

Turrents discussion? SO there.

Whether or not I build them differs according to the situation. If my team is pushing well enough to get our bots past midfield, then maybe I'll build a Longshot or two, but most likely not. However, if the other team is pushing back, or I see experienced player I know on the other team, expect to see 3.3s everywhere, because those will all be mine.

Turrents are a big part of how I play Support, as anyone that's played against me will tell you. If the other team is pushing bots, my turrents will kill the bots in a matter of seconds. If the other team is pushing bots WITH JUICE, then they'll stall the pros and/or bots by giving them something to shoot at. While they do that, Air Strike the incoming wave of bots and, if you can, Ground Zero the Juiced Pro.

Sure, you lose money by doing so, but I'd rather lose money than see my Moneyball downed. Plus, you'll gain a nice amount of money by killing that wave and/or Pro, so use that to your advantage.

You bring up a very good point. If we increase the strength of the turrets, more games will lead to overtime, and we don't want that. However, if something isn't done, turrets will only be useful if a support sits back and defends them, and even then it's not foolproof.

Such a dilemma. More overtime, or worthless turrets? I prefer turrets personally. There's got to be some way to improve turrets without causing an increase in ties.

I said turrets were too weak in the first month and people thought i was merely complaining about juice. Turrets are disproportionally priced to the cost of juice... and unless the timer for juice is long and/or random there will remain little point in making turrets. If juice is still $500 then turrets need to be much cheaper across the board. If the juice timer is long then I'll probably buy grapple 3 instead of buying turrets. (If you know how much I hate grapple then you realize the severity of that statement!)

3.3 Laser turrets are getting nerfed against players and I really don't like that idea. They were the only turret that seemed worth the money. Lasers did not need to be dumbed down; the others needed to be beefed up.

It takes about an equal amount of time to hack/heal a turret as it does to destroy it with the mortar. If your team has more gunners than the enemy has supports (or the same number) then you'll have zero problems killing turrets. Turrets are not strong and if you think they are then you probably play one of two classes that has trouble killing them.

If you're playing game after game that ends in a stalemate then you should seriously examine how you play this game. When I play with 2 or more friends the enemy's turrets are guaranteed to be destroyed within 45 seconds.

First of all that's using a premade team to gain advantage, which isn't a good judge of game length if your opponents are all randoms. Not that I disagree with what your saying, just pointing it out.

Second, what pro has a problem taking out turrets?
Assassins have their sword and smoke bomb to stun turrets.
Snipers can kill turrets without being near them, though it may take them a while.
Assaults have the grenade launcher.
Tanks have the jet gun and product grenade.
Supports have their airstrikes.
Gunners have the mortar launcher.

I'd say the assault is probably the worst at taking down turrets, and that's not saying much. All of these are multiplied with juice except the support, which as of right now is extremely easy to get.

Really, your turrets will last as long as it takes your opponents to get juice.

I don't Think anyone in this thread has played against sxd :shock:

I still have nightmares about the last private match I was up against him in.

Even with the juice bug I still get killed trying to dismantle his bases a lot

I honestly don't think anyone has played a Crossfire match where more then half the team weren't kill farming. If Pro can just waltz into you base and destroy turret after turret then you didn't have map control. Killing bots earns you easy money. Killing bots earns you easy Juice. Escorting your bots prevents easy money and easy juice gain for your enemy.

With the price of Rock-It turrets dropping expect base defense to be just a little harder to crack. Hacked Rock-It turrets are very deadly. Not to mention once the DLC is out Rock-Its will also be more effective against bots.

Kill farming takes your focus off the objective. With your focus off of the objective a single juiced Assassin can wreck havoc on your defenses.

SXD24's guide to posting on the forums:

• 1) Make a post, relevant to the topic at hand, that is informative and good-hearted
  2) Watch as everyone disregards it
  3) Post "4 teh lulz"
  4) Watch as everyone comments on it

Word.

And I abhorred* that match. Wasted almost all my Juice just trying to take YOU out.
*Okay, not really, but you know how defensive I get about my turrents.

That's why I hate playing against you as a support. I'd get maybe one or two turrents down while juiced, then here you come with a plethora of airstrikes and a juiced shotty as I make a mad dash across to the other turrents. ffffffuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu

Do you do all this by yourself? When I play support I try to be defensive too, but I'm not too successful with it unless I sit there overhealing everything. Do you do that too?

I am a skilled offensive Support, but everyone that knows me knows my true power rests in my ability to build up a solid defense. When I'm playing with pubs and I see a good number of recognizable 99s on the opposing team, I will play Support and, for the most part, keep bots away from my moneyball using turrents, even if no one on my team knows how to push lanes. =/

I do this all the time by myself. And yes, in order to play defensively, you have to stay and overheal everything.

Is this fun? Certainly not by most people's standards (although I enjoy it from time to time).

Does it work?
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