JUICE! DAMNED JUICE

Yes :x

Exactly, but why are you letting them?

Oh so yall gonna keep playing the 'Im the not good enough so I dont like Juice card'. Im level 91 Im not the best but I def know what Im doing. I said before I've killed plenty of Juicers. But I guess yall are so good that some spam juicer never gets in and wrecks your ****, well excuse me. They have improved the Juice stuff I just dont like people plalying Monday Night Juicer, people spamming, glitching, whatever just to get juice. I just think the game is too good to be crippled by this unbalacing feature.

If it was unbalanced why can one player deal with it alone?

I'm insanely enraged right now. And it really is a cool story.

Here's my observations on juice and juice rushing:

There seems to be a skill threshold that must be met to be able to deal with a juicing player. It seems that threshold is rather higher than lower. Most skilled players can players can properly CC with their respective classes. However, because that threshold is so high, it turns out that very few people know how to cc a juiced player, and anybody who knows where the juice machine is can juice rush, so to the majority of MNC players juice is unbalanced.

There are always questions of balance but it is relative to context.

Juice is cool. Juice adds an exciting element to the game. I can deal with juiced players, and I don't cry when they burn down my base. It's just part of MNC.

I would love to have a non-juice option for public crossfire. We now have Super Sudden Death Blitz, why not a Hardcore Crossfire? I think that could make for some really fun matches as well.

No juice, if you want juice, play regular crossfire, if you don't play "Dry Crossfire".

I would at least like the option for public matches.

I personally would like to see juice limited to a certain amount of times per person per match. I like the mechanic, and I love the 'take that!' aspect when you stop it but sometimes it just gets annoying to see the same player juicing for the 10th time. Why not limit it to 3 times per player? That way everyone gets to use it but the pub stomps don't degrade quite as quickly. Besides if you have the other team dominated so thoroughly that you can repeatedly beat on them with juice do you really need it that much?

The times its really a disappointment is when you're with the randoms, having a decent time in trying to hold things down until the enemy get their first 500, when the entire match turns into watching the same players looping through with juice. Sure they're stoppable but as said already there is a minimum skill level needed and a class that's built for it. I'm sorry guys but as a support you're not going to cc 2 juiced gunners at the same time and for a juice loop team one juice=infinite juice. Yeah, get a team but not everyone has one, not everyone wants one. I know it shouldn't be balanced solely for solo players but be honest, there are a ton of solo players so why not balance for both? There are mechanics that are balanced for xfire and blitz, why not team and solo?

Besides I want to see it used strategically. You get 3, are you really gonna use it now? I can't see any great reasons to have an Infinite amount. Your veins should pop or you should get major fatigue.
Wouldnt it be more fun if there was another strategic element to juicing?

I was about to make a new thread about this. There is absolutely no way that a juiced assassin should be able to take down every single turret in our base. They kill them way to fast and take almost zero damage.

One 3.3 rocket turret costs $1450, built from the original turret, and $1600 for one that was bought from scratch. Assassins can gain juice in like 2-3 minutes (if they are even even relatively skilled) by killing bots, or buy it for $500. So for 1/3 of the price an assassin can take out a 3.3 rocket turret easily. I think that a 3.3 rocket should easily be able to kill that juiced assassin (unless blinded). Just my thoughts.

It's only 1050 total to build a lvl 3 rocket turret now.

Turrets that are destroyed by assassins are turrets not properly protected IMO.

Hey look, it's an assassin that has to be mele range to destroy turrets efficiently. I wonder where I should stand/bomb/trap to crowd control her.

I flood my base with shave ice with any and all spare cash, so I don't have assassin issues. Gunners can be a problem though if you don't have a good sniper/counter juicing assault/tank.

ice trap the juice machine bra works every time.

Assassins gain juice fast by killing bots? Well then try escorting your bots and stopping the problem early.

^this.

I was adding in the money for the supports hack ability. Not just the price for the turret.

I think Juice is fine where it's at but I also do agree that it takes a certain skill or experience to truly know how to use Juice and how to anti them.

Perhaps if the "I can totally beat down Juiced Pros np" people posted some videos of anti-juicing measures then the "Omgwtfpwn Juiced Pros are impossible to kill and totally Juice rush all the time" people could start seeing what the first group of people are doing from their view.

If anything, it's like playing Tetris. Some people are just made for it, some are just godawful, and then there are people who are uninspired until they see someone play it so elegantly that they are suddenly inspired and become one of the people made for it.

Yes, I'm stoned beyond belief, if anyone was wondering.

And for the record, I'm on both sides. I play assassin quite well and I even think she's wtfpwn when she juices versus turrets, it's ridicilious how fast she burn them down. Though at the same time I have been killed by so many stupid things, ice traps with a 3.3 exploding in my face :evil: for example. Even an unjuiced Support with the shotgun are nasty versus Juiced. Don't even get me started on JUICED Supports... their Shotgun can pretty much one shot any Juiced class, maybe two for those with Armor.

I deal with a Juiced pro as a Tank in this video at around 5 minutes in and I have about half health.

I personally think that juicing is almost completely balanced now, and I was a very strong believer against the power of it before DLC. Other than the laser blaser trick (that I still haven't seen), the ease of gaining juice is just fine in my opinion.

The actual juicing is the real problem. I feel that when people get juice now, they pretty much deserve it. It's really tough as a support to defend his base on his own from a constant barrage of juiced assassins. I know there are ways around it, but many times I can't figure out what to do. It's even worse when there are multiple pros trying to get in, or pros with even stronger capabilities.

The only thing I want is some kind of tutorial telling players how to defend against juicers. That would help anyone looking to learn, but maybe not having the means or time to improve on their own. I know that juice is not broken, but it's skill that players need, not a nerf.

It's kind of hard to give a step by step thing for stopping Juicers from destroying your turrets when you are a Support trying to protect, as there are so many conditions.

One of the common things I do is drop airstrikes** near the turrets to keep certain juiced pros (tank, sniper, assassin) from tearing them down, it usually works and sometimes ends up with a kill if the Juicer wasn't paying attention. While the airstrike is coming down I leave my distance from the Juiced pro and try to keep my H/H on the turret.

If its a Juicer just out to kill pros, or an Assassin swiping @ turrets.. 9 out of 10 times I'll just Grapple them and take the death. If the turrets are still up and one is hacked, that Juiced pro will probably be dead in the end... or at the very least running away. I watch to see if someone else is going to grapple and if they do, I drop the shotgun on the Juiced player. Grappling a swiping Assassin isn't as hard as it looks, even as they spam the sword around like a goof...

Other pros have it a bit easier against Juiced players because their grapples also throw.. and even on maps where they wont get knocked out of the ring it usually still means they won't be insta-dead after their grapple. The supports grapple is practically a tickle.. it almost does 0 damage against a pro. Only time it's useful is against bots (its really good against bouncers) or for slowing a Juiced player down.

Other times.. if the juiced player is just focusing on a turret or the money ball, I'll attempt to shotgun them real quick. This won't work on good players.

**The nerf on the airstrike btw, has seriously hampered the ability to protect your base or turrets from Juiced pros. For example, if you use 2 or all 3 trying to stop a pro and then you die.. when you respawn you have to wait 30-40 seconds more before you even have an airstrike ready, and then it's only just the one... and if you immediately have to use it again.. its a never ending cycle of suck. You have nothing else at your disposal.. the H/H won't do jack, your FB is dead, and getting up close and personal after a respawn with a shotgun on a juiced player is likely suicide. Only option is to hope you can H/H a teammate that knows what they are doing or luckily respawn to heal your turrets before they blow.. other than that you're totally gimped waiting for all your abilities to regen. I dont know of any other situation with any other Pro where they become gimped like this and have little chance of holding their own when by themselves (except when trapped.. friggin icetraps!).

I'm not looking for a step by step guide to stop juicers, but your post is just perfect. All I'm asking is for some tips on how to stop it. I'm sure a lot of people could benefit from something as small as a thread in the guide section. People could just post tips for each pro and examples of awesome juicer takedowns.

Ideally though, I'd like Uber to make a video on how to stop juicers and put it on the Xbox dashboard, but I know that's not necessarily viable.

Here is the problem I faced just this morning. The game clock wasnt even down to 12:00 left and one Assassin had juiced 3 times already. I dont care what he/she did to get it; bought the juice, earned whatever, this should NOT be possible, plain and simple. The premise of the game is: 6 unique and BALANCED classes working together to defend their Moneyball and to destroy the other teams Moneyball It is not 6 classes playing the game watching and fending of Juiced players or figuring out how to get your own juice.

Juice is simple to big a swing factor to be used more than just a couple of times; total. I dont want to hear 'ah if you're good you can easily defend against juicer, i kill 3 a game'. You cant always stay back and watch for juicers, all it takes is one to slip and cause major damage. Again I say the concept and everything fits perfectly in the game, but when I hear other players strategizing and focusing on getting juice; it has become to big a factor in the game. It makes the game turn into a COD K/D thing. That is not what the game is about. And no this doesn't happen every game I know that. And yes a lot has been done to balance it. But at the end day the game is not about juice. Lot of new players are coming in and getting slaughtered by people who know how to game the system, who wants to play that game? Look at the OP and think about the suggestions I do not claim to have all the answers.