Ideas on how to balance the sniper

...
Learn to read.

Actually IIRC you haven't proven how the Assault counters the Sniper 100% of the time yet.
Let's hear it.

slow the trafeling speed of the bullet

in Globa Agenda the sniper was/is almost redeemed useless because of it

I did and it didn't do me any good after reading your post.

Oh right well done you asked for a way to counter snipers 100% of the time and now you've put me in a position where I am going to say "You can't counter anything 100%" and you will go "HAH Snipers are OP!!!" and claim to win the argument.

And thanks to that, I will draw the same card...
You haven't proven you CAN'T counter snipers 100% of the time yet.
Let's hear it.

You are wrong and this is why:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SfxydkPelI
This is a friend of mine and he is far from useless on G.A
True there are many re-recons around though.

[

Wat?
If we both agree on something, why does it have to be proven?

Also - how would not being able to counter Snipers 100% make them OP?
As we both know, within general game play between skilled players, it's unlikely you'll ever be able to counter any class 100%...

Man, if my points were as contradictory and dumb as yours, we'd be in trouble right now.

Anyway - what I more meant to ask was, "Prove to me that a human at their peak skill with Assault, reliably counters a Sniper being played at peak skill by a Sniper".

Also, I'll get this out of the way - as this is your claim, you have burden of proof.
Go for it.

47 paged treath, and still the first replay was spot on..

Keeping a civil discussion with these guys is turning out to be diffcult... :mrgreen:

And what are we agreeing on? :|

It wouldn't make THEM OP, it would make them useless since they wouldn't be able to counter back 100%. There is no "Win Button" in this game. Except for sniper headshots, bomb ring-outs, slam ring-outs, ETC. But even they are based on player skill and player skill might as well be measured in chance to succeed depending on your decisions.

Then why pose the question?

And I don't recall saying an assault can counter snipers 100% of the time. If you are refering to my experience against a skilled assault then you misunderstood or just blatantly assumed that was my point.

Wow, you get steamed easily don'tcha?
Let it go man, let it go...

And how am I going to prove it? Are you asking for video footage of me getting owned by assaults? For all you know I could fake that and you would just say "Not good enough" over and over and the result would be nothing.

Ask somebody on these forums who is maining assault to show you how, apparently you're having troubles with it so...

A few pages back I posted this:

This is how this discussion is ending even if I provide any proof, hence what's the point?
You simply refuse to be satisfied about this issue until you get your wish.

EDIT:

Win.

You're ridiculous.

Here's a few screenshots using Grenade 3 as an example.

This position on the left is completely unsnipable but can keep the lane pushed beyond the "neutral arc." It's the same position on the right. Moving up to the neutral arc leaves you vulnerable to the Sniper at the middle or on the far right until you get to the neutral arc and are again not a Sniper target while pushing the lane further into enemy territory. As an Assault or Assassin or a Tank (any class with a charge, lunge or boost ability) it's easy to shoot up to the middle arch with your boost without making the slightest target out of yourself. If you are a Support or Gunner then you must use the Bots for cover against the Sniper in order to move forward. If the Sniper cover is too great, then you have to stay back until the Sniper is taken care of (hence the Sniper's job is called ZONING you, as you are unable to advance without being taken out).

Here's another screenshot to illustrate Gunner height vs Black Jack height. No class's head hitbox sits ABOVE the Black Jack hitbox.


You people are just absurd. This topic DOES need to be locked because you refuse to admit that if you just play safe the Sniper can't do a damn thing to you. Magically waggling his legs with WASD doesn't do anything if you stay out of Sniper perch target zones. EVERY map has SAFE LOCATIONS to push the lane from that are completely out of any perch's line of sight. Almost EVERY CLASS (except for Support) has a long range weapon to push lanes from these safe locations. Just because you hurdur out into the Sniper's line of fire doesn't make the Sniper OP, it makes you stupid.

Bad idea. Explosive shots hurt.

The only way to push on GrenadeIII against good Snipers is to use jetpacks between each bridge, and make sure your head is covered by the circling bridge above.

Whatever dude that's a situational exception. Yeah if you're getting hounded by snipers AND constant explosive spam then you're not going to be able to push forward -- what's your point?

He's talking about the explosive rounds the sniper uses

My point was just to let you know that pushing a lane by hiding behind the bots can be a bad idea (on Grenade)

I understand that. The fact that you offered another method of pushing the lane only proves the point that there are multiple methods of pushing up the lane safely, as well as you mentioning specifically that it "CAN BE" (as in it's not 100% always true, as situations change) also holds well to the point of Sniper's being fine, because they aren't on super constant always overwatch with explosive rounds leveled first every single game every time catching every movement by every player.

I'm spending way too much time in this topic.

ProTip: When playing Ammo Mule, one of the OMFG SNIPERS ARE SO OP maps, consider pushing through the central building that offers cover throughout most of it.

PS: Still waiting tinygod, quote me.

The fact that you can't counter anything 100% - please, read what I'm quoting before you start typing what you're thinking.

Um. Wat.
Okay let me rephrase "How would a class not being able to counter Snipers 100%, make the Sniper OP?"

Do you know what a 100% counter is?
It's when in a game, a class (e.g. Sniper) has absolutely no chance to beat its opponent (e.g. an Assault) - obviously that's not the case, which is why I changed my wording to say "reliable".

I like it how you just said exactly what I've been saying for this whole thread.
As Snipers get better, they have an "I Win" button.

That's why I actually altered the wording below, to not confuse you.

No, video footage means nothing.
Do it through maths, hypotheticals... design perspectives.

Tell me what about the Assault, makes him so capable as a Sniper counter - tell me how he prevents himself from being quickscoped as he tries to get a good angle on the Sniper.

More of this "Well, you're a bad player" crap?
Really?
I assure you, my Assault is fine, and I dominate bad Snipers, and "okay" Snipers.
I doubt you've ever even seen a good Sniper.

Is it win though?
Wouldn't the idea of needing to use one class to counter itself, demonstrate balance issues?
Puts the other classes in a poor position if a Sniper is required to counter another Sniper to win, yes?

sounds like a death trap. :ugeek:

From Scathis himself:

This thread is a living testimony to the Sniper being fine according to Scathis' line of logic.

gtfo all of you

Okay now you're just being childish i'm going to be blunt. Are you trying to provoke me or are you just dumb? Seeing as you are having troubles writing something as simple as a an s, followed by a h, followed by a u, followed by double r's, followed by double y's. If you can't spell it properly, you reading issues. This makes me wonder if you are actually reading yourself since you keep claiming I am not reading properly failing to see your "Hidden Meanings". :|

No that's not what we agreed about. You were trying to make me describe a way for the assault to have a 100% chance to win against the sniper. Contradiction guides you.

For once something we agree on, yet you word it provokingly as if I said something totally different.

Which they deserve. Since you have such a big issue about it, simply stop playing if you find yourself completely incapable of dealing with it.

Oh this one is easy! You see where the sniper is focusing and move when he is bothered by something else. Then you simply ignite that little jetpack of yours, fly over to his platform, place a bomb under his wobbly little legs as you so kindly described it and blow him away. Depending on the direction he flies on, doesn't matter as the result stays the same, you dealt with him and he is no longer posing a threat for your team. Kill him or not, entirely depending on how frag hungry and clever you are. Cleverness plays a role in everything I described in fact, as it wouldn't be very clever to walk into his line of fire if he really is as godlike as you claim they are... You must have a sniper phobia or something. Small joke.

The way you make your posts out to be, you are not very convincing of that... :|

Yeah, umm, mentioned it earlier. You see you pretty much make yourself sound like one...

And here you go restarting the whole debate again and we are going to be kicked back to scratch...

Lock this topic already, it's not leading anywhere.

I can't believe how ******* ridiculous you're being though. You actually had to quote him, erase his name, replace it with your dumb inflammatory bullshit and even if that's not the case it isn't that hard to spell nor is it hard to go back a page and look at his name.

See? I can do fun quote tricks too.

Scathis' line of logic in binary here, mate. The world does not work like that. There are always shades of grey. A debate does not mean things are fine, AT ALL. It means people disagree. It means the discussion is more sublte than just everyone agreeing or disagreeing on something. Nobody says the whole game is overwhelmingly unbalanced. Guess what, people sometimes discuss things at another level than ALL OR NOTHING. Everyone will never agree on everything because some people have a vested interest in keeping things put.

Sniper is a part of the game. That part is unbalanced. Does it mean the whole game is ? No. Therefore nothing has been proven. Nobody goes anywhere.

Sorry, your God's logic and your interpretation of it is far from perfect.

Too bad that Scathis is god when it comes to MNC.