I am sorry...NERF the sniper

I would definitely say that out of all the classes in the game, Sniper is probably the most OP. That said, I think it takes a skilled player to really make it feel OP. Not that I don't enjoy it. I used to main gunner/support but I recently switched to sniper just because it's a lot more fun (and takes a lot more skill to be good).

I think the sniper traps could stand to have a proximity noise - similar to that of the Assault's bomb. Or at least be a little more noticeable. I'm talking more for pub play in this case than experienced/tourney play. Either way, though, It'll force sniper's to be a little more choosey with where they place their traps, which is good.

I also wouldn't mind if damage against the money ball and turrets with the sniper rifle was reduced. The most annoying thing is to have a sniper sit in their base sniping out our turrets. The flak + snipe combo is ridiculously potent on top of that. As a sniper, with one juice and my sniper rifle, I can take down the entire money ball when it's at full health.

I would also say, and I hate to say it because I love it, but the level 3 grapple is pretty ridiculous. When it comes to pretty much any class, tanks and gunners included. If I don't snipe them to death before they get to me, I just lure them into a trap, and then grapple them. Probably the only class I worry about as a sniper is an assault, because they can get their charge off before the ice trap stops them, which if I am distracted killing someone else, can end a nice kill streak.

Player skill is player skill, that doesn't mean the class is over powered. For a class to be over powered, you can put it in anyone's hands and then would dominate the board and be next to untouchable. I've seens snipers like that, but I've seen snipers that don't know what they are doing and can be killed by my gunner from medium distance because they are focused on trying to head shot a bunny hopping support healing a turret.

By that same logic however you could put that player as any other class and they would still be underpowered with it. As such player skill is not a valid way to determine how under/overpowered a class truly is.

The Sniper does need some tweaking, mostly concerning their Grapple and Freeze Traps. Why the Sniper is the only class that adds a throw to their Grapple at level 2 and damage at level 3 instead of the opposite makes no sense. Both the Gunner and Assault have increased damage at level 2 and a throw effect at level 3 so the Sniper should follow this established pattern. Even the Tank follows this pattern to a degree except instead of throw they have knockdown.

Regarding Freeze Traps, there are a couple issues here. First is that just like the Assault's Bomb and Support's Air Strike, friendly fire should occur so if the Sniper is within the radius of their own trap they should be frozen as well. Also, there is no reason why the Sniper needs 3! Freeze Traps (just like the Support does not need 3 Air Strikes). Two of them should be more than enough (for the Support as well).

Pretty sure you two are agreeing here, which is why I'm puzzled.

Anyway, one of the things I really want to reiaterate about this thread is that A Sniper can be really effective without using his "primary" tool. Long range firepower is good, and headshots are badass, but the Sniper only needs to rely on them if in the hands of player with broken face buttons or no knowledge of how to play the game. Flak is incredibly useful AoE damage, traps can set up headshots, choke a key area, or just protect your ***, and the grapple is more powerful than the Assassin backstab 80% of the board whines about.

The SMG isn't the greatest weapon in the game, and isn't utterly decimating, but fast rate of fire and reload speed out of the box make it damaging enough to be pretty threatening. And that's the secondary weapon. People probably shoudn't be able to roll over other classes so effectively. People especially shouldn't be able to while neglecting the primary weapon of the class, especially when people are still falling back on the "learn your role" excuse for why Assassin is fine as-is. Selective reasoning, as it were.

I'm not a great sniper, but I can actually play Sniper fairly well regardless. One doesn't need to snipe to be a Sniper. Well, one doesn't have to snipe well. I can pull a couple headshots, kill long range, etc. But I don't have to in order to be effective or useful. Nobody does. It's great if you really love snipers, but not so much if you like balance.

I could bring in custom classes, stuff like that, but honestly, that still sort of falls to player skill. I mean, you can copy builds easier than you can learn to play better, but it's still a variable that's more subjective.

Ok. After reading every post in this thread, it is clear that the Sniper is indeed overpowered. Most of us are in agreement about that.

Ever go into a match and see those 99 Rank players? (of course you do!)
Take a wild guess which class they usually play?
If you guessed Support and/or Sniper, you win the big prize!
C'mon Bullseye, toss out that money! :mrgreen:

Feel free to take another wild guess as to how they got to that high rank.
If you guessed "by playing the overpowered Sniper and/or Support class" again, you win even more money!!!
(end sarcasm)

This game is clearly unbalanced. Anyone can see that.

I am not quite sure what to make of this. 99's being support or sniper is not true for the games i am playing.
Besides, you get to be 99 by playing a lot. Even if a class is OP (which i believe is not true), i doubt it would really make a huge difference what class you are using to determine the level you are.

I love how its supports and snipers who are the lv. 99 even though that is just time based. Also where do Gunners fall? They get more kills out of any of them. Why aren't the "level 99's" using him?

I'm going out on a limb and going to say snipers and supports are the easier to get juiced and can do it in relative safety. Gunners on the other hand are slow and cumbersome and can be killed easily. So if you are just trying to level up and protect your k/d, go with support or sniper.

Eh, just make it so the grapple doesn't instant kill classes but does good damage. The skill drain on the freeze traps kind of irks me, seeing as once any class get frozen in it, it's a death sentence

I wouldnt get close to an assassin even when frozen.

Due to how lag works, if player A is standing still (frozen) and player B is walking toward him, player B will be able to grapple first. BECAUSE: Player B will reach grappling range (in his perspective) while player A still sees him as being farther away.

For the same reason, it's usually impossible to dodge an assault's charge except by predicting it. By the time you see him charging, it's probably too late - the game has already decided that you've been hit.

Still gotta disagree with you, a good Gunner can rack up kills faster than a Support and a Sniper.

Yes, but a gunner is going to get killed more often than a sniper or support if you play to protect your k/d

He did say "in relative safety," which is true for them but not gunner. Gold accuracy makes it easier to kill from a distance with a gunner, but still not as safe or nearly as effective in terms of "relative safety."

The only thing that bugs me about the sniper is the rediculous rate they can put out ice traps that you can't really see on the ground cause most of the time they've clipped thru the ground. They should be more visible and shouldn't be tossed out so rediculously fast.

Yeah, like there is zero cool down time, and an experienced sniper can cover every angle to reach him and pin down the other team so you can't get to him without a 3 man rush.

On top of which, they've very likely got the ability to put a new trap down right after the old one's triggered. Trigger, BLAMO, drop new trap.

Out of all of this, I still find the gunner to be too easy to play with and be effective. Your entire strategy pretty much consists of walking while holding the right trigger down for kills until you get a clear shot at the base.....then pressing Y and holding that button down even more. At least most of the time I can ignore a sniper who covers himself in ice traps as long as it's not Steel Peel seeing as he won't defend his base as it will require him to leave the safety of his traps. When I really think about it, I only hate snipers on Steel Peel, and I also just hate Steel Peel.

Exactly, I have no problem with a sniper being able to fortify himself. I do have a slight problem with a sniper being able to keep himself fortified against waves of enemies without having to leave his little fort.