How MNC pwns Halo Reach

In CoD it takes 2-3 bullets to kill anything. Grenade launcher is a 1 shot kill. How is that harder? You even get a helicopter to kill everything for you.

I think people play CoD for the same reason people like to play SWAT or Snipers in Halo: It's easy. You don't have to work to get a kill. I don't like games where I'm smarter, but you win because you were camping around the corner and waiting for me.

By your logic Halo is the most skillful fps in existence because it takes more shots to kill a person.

It's harder because the margin for error is much, much smaller than in a game like MNC. You must react faster, shoot better, and think quicker to win. If you don't you'll die instantly over and over again. There isn't as much strategy, but it's far less forgiving.

Spoken like someone who was unable to adapt to non-forgiving gameplay. You weren't smart at all if you keep running in front of someone's line of fire. That's a very noobish thing to say. The problem with your argument is that it goes both ways, but you didn't bother to think it through. It's also easier to die, which is what probably sent you running.

CoD requires little to no team-work, unlike a game such as MNC or Shadowrun, or even Halo.

Nobody who played CoD competitively would say that. I think you just exposed yourself. You just lost a lot of credibility.

I think the loads and loads of "clutch" 1v5 situations that we see in just about every 5 or so machinima posts support Shammas' position much more than yours.

Even in CoD 4 promod there were tons of these types of videos.

I've seen montages composed of players doing this in TOURNAMENTS.

CoD takes a good amount of twitch skill, but with all of the extremely powerful weapons in that game, there is very little variance in what you will come across (and the game battles/MLG community banning most of the weapons which would bring variety to the game don't really help the situation.).

That's an incredibly weak argument. If you guys really think teamwork doesn't matter in CoD you're deluding yourselves. There's simply nothing more that can be said. Any team that communicates and works together will be better than one that doesn't in any game. If we had a MNC tournament and someone killed 5 guys then that would mean strategy doesn't matter in MNC?

Utter nonsense.

But in a way you proved my point. With strategy and skill you can do more in CoD than MNC. CoD is on a different level, you can lose much, much more quickly. The fact that players are able to make more of an impact shows that the skillcap is much higher.

You're outvoted on this one, cheese. CoD is not a thinking man's game. (To be fair, I don't think MNC is much of one, either.)

It's also not really a team game beyond "You go that way, I'll go this way." A cohesive team will of course do better, but teams are more important in MNC. In CoD, it's generally just as good to have 1 or 2 guys who are having a good day. That's what individual players being able to make more impact in CoD shows, not that the "skillcap is higher." :lol:

Playing CoD is all about reflexes and cheap tactics, kinda like being a sniper in MNC. I've had my fun in CoD, but it boils down to twitch, dropshot, learn the map routes, and when in doubt, lob a grenade. Do 3 out of 4 of those things well, and you'll go far.

At any rate, I don't know why you're pole-riding for CoD so hard on the MNC forum. If CoD is really so superior, maybe you should just go play that.

I haven't been outvoted, it just seems like I'm the only one who got anywhere in CoD. Everyone else sounds like they run around not communicating getting picked off. Listen to the feedback, "Teamwork doesn't matter" "I saw some video where a guy killed 5 dudes". They come off as completely clueless about CoD, which I suppose would explain their comments.

There is strategy, it's just over some people's heads. Where and how you engage the enemy is crucial but they probably just run forward and blame the game when they inevitably die. It's an attitude as old as videogames. MNC removes that by providing lanes and having few, if any, places to hide. I like it, but it definitely dumbs down strategies.

It's the result of a discussion. If you can't read a thread maybe you shouldn't post?
I already said I like MNC better, it's just far easier to play.

CoD "strategy" over peoples' heads? That sounds pretty self-impressed.

I didn't see anyone say that teamwork didn't matter. Rather, it isn't as important to doing well, which is a fact. Black Ops might change things up, but almost every gametype in CoD can be won through kills alone. No MNC game can be won just on kills.

It's all just one person's opinion, but no need to continue believing it's just because noone else played the games enough. I went gold cross in CoD4. Didn't get as far in Modern Warfare 2 though, because I got bored of it all. But I get where you're coming from. I just think you're overstating matters.

If someone says that a tactical shooter has no strategy, then yes it's over their heads. That's all I'm saying. I do overstate things sometimes.

Competitive CoD in SnD is just watching every area and waiting in a head-gitch. Demo is the same, but you respawn. CTF is the same concept of camping in head glitches.

And don't say that you've "gone anywhere" in CoD when I've played with and against top teams.

There is a huge difference between MNC's 5 man Multi kill, and an Ace in SnD. 5-6 man multi kill will not win you the game in MNC. Aces = teams getting beaten by one person.

The point is not that team work is not beneficial in CoD games, but it is certainly less of a REQUIREMENT than in MNC. (which was Shammas' statement that I quoted.)

Also, I'm not saying that I think that team work does not matter on the basis of a random youtube video. But when I watch countless recaps of Pro players getting clutches and beating 1 vs 3/4/5 situations in competitive matches and even tournements, it certainly provides some evidence of teamwork being less of a requirement than in MNC. It is not worthless, but there is an astounding amount of video evidence of pros winning competitive matches basically BY THEMSELVES.

What are these things you can do with strategy and skill in CoD that you cannot do in MNC? In CoD, with more strategy, you can choke more points on the map, and breach buildings from multiple points easier, and camp the objective in effective ways. With more skill, your twitch aiming is better, and you know where to stick explosives/special grenades, and can clutch/react/adapt better.

Even with all of this, it is still an EXTREMELY limited skill set compared to any of the six classes in MNC. Factor in teamwork in MNC, and there is a huge variety of tactics and strats that can be employed and that have to be countered. The game is undeniably deeper than CoD, and thus would have a much higher skill cap because there is more to master, and more to counter other strats.

The fact that players are able to make more of an impact as individuals says nothing about the skill cap of the game. You just took two concepts, stuck them in the same sentence, and said one proves the other.

It is, however, very indicative of team work not being as high of a requirement in CoD.

I know you're good at MNC so we'll just agree to disagree. I don't believe you're bad and making excuses, we just see things differently. I'm going to now go play plants vs. zombies, which is the most skillful game in the universe.


that was a joke

Nope. Teamwork could have overcome it. If anything it proves that teamwork is more crucial as not working together has faster, harsher consequences. I'm just saying that suggesting that teamwork isn't vital in a tactical shooter is ridiculous. If a swat team stormed a room and 1 guy shot them all in the back, that's a pretty crappy swat team.

1 last thing:

That is the literal definition of a skill cap. How far your skill can take you within the boundaries of the game. Skill can seperate players more in CoD than MNC as your comments show.

Suggesting that CoD is a Tactical Shooter is ridiculous.

So, just to recap your response to my example:
-Team with 5 kills 4 people, due to team work.
-Remaining person clutches, due to "not enough" team work.

-Which team had MORE team work?
-Which team, won?

You do realize that just described CoD Right?

Then again, it also says perfect dark is a tactical shooter. Silly Wikipedia.

The winning team. The other team started strong but forgot to cover their backs at the end. Next time they should work together better. I don't see how screwing up somehow proves teamwork isn't necessary. If anything it proves that it's vital. If the 1st team had worked together better it wouldn't have been 5v1 in the 1st place. But yes, losing 5v1 shows that you definitely need to work on teamwork. I suppose you'll tell me there's no strategy in real life conflicts either. After all, the same scenario could happen.

No, it really didn't. A couple of the key sentences would be...

CoD is a lot of things, including fun. But it's about as tactical as Unreal Tournament.

When it comes to teamwork, the whole point is that you cannot lose 5v1 in MNC. It is impossible. Even if the 1 was a level 99 support from the MLG, not going to happen. The game was built such that it takes at least a somewhat competent team to overcome the other team.

Go to Gamestop and ask for the most popular tactical shooter and see what they give you.

And again, it seems the tactics of CoD are over your head if you think there aren't any. Ever switch to your sidearm and fire off a shot and then circle back around to flank the enemy with your silenced primary? Probably not.

I'm sorry you guys are unable to formulate a strategy in a game like CoD, that doesn't mean other people are also unable to do so. The stuff you guys are saying are sound more and more like excuses sadly.

"These games typically simulate realistic combat, thus making tactics and caution more important than quick reflexes in other action games."

The point being, as stated earlier, CoD is primarily Twitch intensive, in addition to being ridiculously off in the realism scheme of things.

Tactical Shooters are pretty much universally accepted as more sim-like in nature.

Though to be fair, game review and ads for the game have been using "tactical" shooter to describe it, even though it falls no where even remotely close to a tac shooter.