Should Pelicans return to T1?

There were two major issues with Pelicans at T1 (only one in my mind, but let's roll with two):

1. They eliminated the delay in expansion time, you could roll the more efficient land fabbers around like they were air fabbers.

2. The one I believe was the major issue: Commander rushing. As shown by Matiz and Clopse this was virtually indefensible, relying on a lucky fighter to stop.

Neither of these seem to be major factors any more. Expansion is far more dangerous due to faster units at T1 making it much riskier, and more importantly Commander rushing would no longer work. The tactic relied on eliminating your opponent's energy to neutralise their Ubercannon, except the Commander is its own energy production now so you cannot neutralise his cannon.

These changes to the game make me wonder whether it's worth examining bringing the Pelican back to T1.

+1

Maybe first we can try making it possible to build t2.

Move to T1, make 'em a bit slower.
Remember the Atlas? It wasn't very fast too, but T1.

Basically how both RCBM and Statera do their T1 transports.

I think this should be the thing on the bottom of anyone's FIX THIS STUFF list. It causes more balance problems instead of encouraging different play, imho.

Mostly because their mechanics are really weird. Super-fast pick-up and drop-off coupled with the speed of a Fighter? I mean, what?

We need all of the UI transport options too, before we can even begin arguing about multi-unit transports and boat transports.

yes t1 pelicans would be good for gameplay and solve some mobility issues that tank play has. Balance is easy, and if not, i'm sure mered will be able to balance it for you in 2 minutes tops. He's really good at adapting to new things and figuring out how they work so very quickly.

Using transport ui is easy enough. Select units, shift use on each pelican and they will all get picked up.

The main problem was the insta drop. I'm not sure if it still is an issue but was so fast you could see fighters and drop your units before their fighters got within range. I think It's a great idea once we get some landing animation. Will make games really interesting.

I would love to see a crash animation aswell. It could also be used for astreus. If your unit is transported and the transport dies then the transported unit will crashland, take damage and potentially explode because of that. It was amazing in the game Zero-K i think it will work out in PA too because it removes the ridiculous commander kills with 1 or 2 heatseekers when its being picked up, but it doesn't entirely remove risk since the crash will do damage too. Also, its just amazing to see a robot crashland and then continue the fight like it didn't even happen.

I believe the should be T1. It is hard enough to get to T2 now that I don't think it's a big issue. And commanders are a lot weaker than they used to be. If the commander pelican rush returns as a problem I have no issue with an edge case fix that says coms cannot be loaded on pelicans. Astreasus provided a more easily balanced com transport already.

I think they should be T1. I made a little mod that does this ages ago.

I would like to see the area commands for loading and unloading be improved. One way this could be done would be to highlight individual units inside the load area command to show which ones will actually be picked up.

There are so many little UI tweaks like this that could make PA 100x better. I assume we don't have mod hooks for any of this?

Sometimes I worry we wont be seeing any new art or animations as it seems most of the art team was sent to HR and presumably let go? I suppose they retained some people for making the commanders but given the speed of that and the large number still to be made, those people won't be making any new assets anytime soon. This was part of my motivation for the failed push to allowed modded commander skins as new 'units' but lets not revisit that fiasco.

It would be fun if they can be t1, but I think other issues with the balance should be fixed first. Making t1 air transports that "work" isn't easy I think, so it is probably better not to make them before the rest of the balance is in a better state.

I'm torn on this. On the one hand, it is true that they will destabilize balance a lot. For example for now most people only build 'forward facing' fortifications, but widespread t1 transports would mean you could easily drop behind walls if there is no AA protection. At the same time, why rebalance everything once these go in, if they are to go in at all?

1) Dox have AA, dox easily early game swarm everywhere. Dox definitely prevent pelicans from dropping commanders near other commanders.

2) Dox and t1 buffs also make it harder to expand even with quick-speed.

In light of that, something can happen to Pelicans:

1) Pelicans can become t1.
2) Pelicans can become t2 vehicle. That way, they are included with their "target audience".
3) Pelicans remain t2 air, and are given a mild health buff (50) and/or a radar-invisibility, both possibly returning their snipe-potential when combined with vanguards or such.

I think lazer turret will have to be able to target air units. The slow moving ones at least: Drop an inferno at the back of a turret and the turret is dead before it turns. Expensive enough to defend areas as it is.

Lets us drop tank behind point defense lines. Makes defenses even weaker. Exactly what the balance needs.

I think we need to see how the balance gets moving forward, then see how it will fit in. I like the idea of it being T1 but i think it's best to see how the balance gets before making changes and then having to undo them.