Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - UI

http://www.mavorsrants.com/2012/11/planetary-annihilation-engine.html

Discuss.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

I've probably missed the point a bit here, but is the implication that you would open up a webpage in game to control the game? A bit like the shift+tab interface in steam but to actually control the game.

That sounds unwieldy, somewhat unreliable and vulnerable to disconnects, whilst the last one arguably is not such an issue nowadays I prefer a built in interface if I'm understanding this right. Even if it limits potential for modding somewhat, generally its only MMO's where I feel a strong need to radically alter the UI, better to just do it right to begin with I think. But as I say maybe I am totally misunderstanding this.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

You are misunderstanding. The web browser part is invisible to the end user and only comes into play if you want to mod the game. There is no external connection it's all local. It just happens that it's used to render the UI.

Basically if you aren't a programmer the post is probably not going to make sense to you.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

ok all sounds good then

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Sir, you just got RSS'D

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Also vahilior, don't forget that modding could require more than just minor UI changes, some Total Conversions could require an entire UI overhaul just for the bare essentials required by that TC.

Neutrino this is all sounding very cool, thought I'll wait until more FA coders weight in

BTW Neutrino, did you see my thread in regards to TC style modding?

Mike

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

It seems like a very good idea.

I just don't see how we will draw on the planets/units.
Will we be able to directly draw some hmtl structure on the planet and then modify its properties with javascript?

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

There will be some 3d interface element stuff available from the js. Basically the UI is broken into two portions, the 2d stuff and the 3d "in-world" stuff like selections / orders etc. So the JS will have an api that can control some of the 3d stuff as well.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

That sounds like a pretty neat solution neutrino! Certainly good for modding and easier to manage on multiple platforms. I like!

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Do we have to use javascript only?

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Define only.'

Also keep in mind this is the client side scripting solution. Haven't talked about the server yet.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Only as in only use it for UI modding.... Don't like the syntax of that language of that.....

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

What language do you want to use?

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

That looks so pretty. Sadly I can't pre-order yet (40$ is too much right now for me).

What if beta acess was given at 40$ too while giving something more special at 60 and 90?

PS: Posted on Facepunch the pre-order link, hope it helps.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

I cannot think of any scripting language that has a nice syntax. This is one of the reasons why the ARE scripting languages - you can achieve a lot with little effort while at the same time obfuscating what the code does

I personally welcome the choice of JavaScript/webkit, it will immediately enable many people to modify the UI without learning a crapload of stuff.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

On one hand, JS is definitely one of the worst languages I have to work with. On the other hand, I work on web development and (much as I can) UI design for a living, I should feel at home.

"Anything but JS" would be fine for me (well, maybe not Brainfuck) ; though if we can use things like JQuery it should be bearable.
Btw, does someone knows how good or bad Dart is?

And thank you for paying so much attention to the UI, it is so often ignored, for sad results, and not only in the video game industry...


Also :
Apparently the human eye has less resolution on the blue (the cells are more spaced on the retina IIRC), so it is harder to distinguish forms in blue than in any other colour.
Which means that blue is the single worst colour that can be picked for an UI.
(Which also means that every single UI in SF shows since Hollywood heard about HUDs is retarded, but that shouldn't be a surprise.)
So please, if you ever decide to use blue as the default colour, allow the user to change it.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

While I think of javascript as one of "these ugly languages used by people to paste websites together" this might be a good solution from an objective standpoint, lets just hope it works out performance-wise.
It is definitely great to see how much effort you guys spent on making the whole thing modable.

EDIT:
Oh and I am very interested to see a planet of the archetype "acid", if such a thing might actually exist already

EDIT2:
Another thing: Please dont expose any functions to the javascript-layer that might be used for cheating-ui-mods, SupCom:FA kinda failed at this regard.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

Will AI routines be open to customization? If so, will I be able to create data structures to store relevant data for my new routines?

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

We haven't talked about AI yet.

Re: Planetary Annihilation Engine Architecture Update #1 - U

As a "regular" (non-web) developer, I definitely have a strong bias against Javascript. However, I understand the motivation and I think that overall it sounds like your Webkit solution for UI has a lot of potential.

Things that come to mind:

• JS has an annoying behaviour where the var keyword is optional, and you can declare a new variable just by assigning to it. This results in really annoying errors from typos during assignment. I think the way around this is to support ECMAScript 5, which has a strict mode that doesn't let you mistype variable names. Maybe that's super-obvious and completely moot if you're using Webkit, but it's something I'd be really happy to see supported.
• In theory, is there anything stopping someone from writing a fully functional AI as a "UI mod" under this setup? If the API provides access to everything the player knows, and can execute code sending orders over time (plus, ideally, in response to events sent by the API), how do you stop someone from writing (admittedly really cool) micro automation of every unit under their control? Or is that a non-issue if everyone has access to the same UI mods, and servers can restrict their use arbitrarily?
• How much do you expect to write in terms of animation support, and make available to modders? My understanding is that HTML5 is very powerful, but you really have to roll your own stuff or use an existing JS library if you want to succinctly make your interface fluid and pretty.
• Will the API be event-based? Maybe that's a stupid question, but it seems that UI mods could get heavy really fast if people aren't discouraged from polling.
• I am also really looking forward to hearing more about your solution, and eventually trying it out in the alpha!