I have decided to stop playing MNC. Heres why:

I've decided that this game will not get any more of my game time - and I figured it would be decent to leave a note as to why.
And maybe learn if I had completely overlooked something in the factors that went into that decision.

If you are already in "What do I care?" position, fair enough. Leave an testosterone boasting unconstructive comment and go back and have fun in game.

Keep in mind that the following is my opinions and that I am open to adjusting those opinions if presented with sufficiently compelling arguments. I would love to see well presented counter arguments to what I am about to present of my own. Even if I might not agree with them.

When I first started playing I was stomped time and time again in the multitude of instant death situations this game presents. I was raging internally, and with my friend who was also playing, about OP assasins. Then I read up a bit here, and decided that I had missed something in the way I played the game. I was not using the different classes skills nearly as much as I should have and relied way to much on just using the weapon in hand. I figured out the custom endorsements I needed for my way of playing, learned which situations to stay away from and I learned to recognise the assasins hum.
When those adjustments were in place I started having fun. No classes were my mortal enemies, but no classes were cakewalks to come up against either. I have to say that Uber has managed to balance them pretty nicely.

So at present I have clocked about 90 hours in the game and are currently around 390 in the income rankings. Not a complete star, but usually in the top of the roster after each match.

So whats the beef?

The core of a match is to help your bots get to the other teams money ball so it can be damaged - and of course prevent the other team from doing the same. But there are so many elements in the gameplay that can invalidate the work you put into that objective via easily reached shortcuts or interruptions, that you time and time again feel punished for doing what it seems you were meant to do. Too many games leave you feeling that the game robbed you of the reward for a push. Not other players. The game.

I am talking about the annihilator, ejectors, juice and jackbots.
(At this point a lot of you will start raging. Please read my objections)

Annihilator:
When used best its a one button wipeout of the other teams bot lanes for a measly amount. Completely resets any work you have put into pushing your bots forward. Or just work put into not having them pushed back. Or a rather meaningless extra stomp on a team already on their heels.
Imagine a similar button in counterstrike, dota.. hell, any competition.
Imagine it not being in the game and Uber presenting it: "We are putting a button in the middle of the map that will kill all the bots on the other team for 250$".
Robs a team of the reward they should reap for their work with very little effort required.

Ejectors:
Mini annihilators and excellent, cheap one button attack on all bots and players in a rather large area. Punishing players that are actively pushing lanes on the ground that can't keep an eye all the time on the (relatively) remote triggers that can kill them any moment. My beef with them would probably be less if they did not cover such a large portion of the botlanes and covered such a large area. As they stand they are cheap, fast negation of other peoples much harder work. Again robs reward with very little effort required.
I will not say the idea behind the ejectors are completely out of place like the annihilator. But they are way to effective as is. And stupidly cheap on top of that.

Juice:
Not an idea thats completely bonkers as a concept. But as it stands it is way too powerful. Put up towers and see them torn down in no time. Get a player cornered and down and see him flip from being assuredly dead to ripping you (and potentially quite a few more) apart in a second. Again a shortcut quickly negating teamwork and affort.
In general I have issues with the concept of bestowing further advantage on someone for already doing good. But I can live with that, but not the magnitude of the effect. And definately not the fact that it can be bought.
In general its just too wild a swing in power for it to be an enjoyable part of the game for me.

The ones who have gotten this far might be thinking "All of that can be disabled(buying of juice at least)".
And we have, on some of the servers we are running. And the games there are much more enjoyable in my opinion.

But that leads me to jackbots:
Just as you have gotten your bots deep into the other teams base your hear "Jaaaackbot!". And you want to rip someones head off. Completely resets the bot lanes because the normal bots stop spawning while they are out there. And they vaporize the ones still out there. Again completely negates the effort you have put into getting your bots close and establishing the pressure that generates on the other team.

It all adds up to a lot of frustation and very little tangible reward. At least not enough that can be connected directly to a tactical and focused player and team effort.

Which in the end makes it feel a worthless way to spend your time. Which can seem a bit moronic argument considering we are talking about playing videogames.
But in the end, when I play a game want to feel some aspect of skill (mental/visual/motor) was tested.

And in this game I have a hard time figuring out if and what it was.
Because it constantly resets whatever effort that seemed like it mattered. The game. Not other players.


Whew, that was a longer one that I planned. So tear it apart.

Though it may sound harsh, these issues are easily dealt with with enough practice. While the team that controls the Annihilator controls the flow of the match that just means its more of an objective.

Your issue seems to be that there are a few slightly more in-depth tricks that you could learn.

The Annihalator, while not the center of the match, should at least be at the back of your mind. Keeping an extra 2-300$ on your hands can sometimes be more important than getting that new skill or "spawnin' da fodder".

With Jackbots all it takes is a little teamwork. I had a match two days ago on lazer razor where the jackbot was at the threshold or our base and every member of my team came together and laid the smackdown on that overblown slot machine. Also when I jackbot is summoned, spawn bots. You may catch the enemy off guard.

I understand the juice complaint but I just deal with it via grappling the juicing player. If they aren't ringed out it will at least take up their time.

i whole heartedly agree, they are annoying as all get out at first. but once you understand the mechanics they become little more than a nuisance that keeps you from getting long kill streaks by thier suicide methods.

Yes these are,... very vital map mechanics. They all make this game a team game. If they werent in place and all you had to do is push bots then 1 amazing player could easily win a game for a team. With these map mechanics in place it emphasizes team work.

Jackbots: With a couple people you can kill them right as they walk out of thier spawn, keeping them from killing your bots on the field.

Annihilator: Working as a team to deny an area to the enemy capitalizes on annihilator usage. It makes you have to spread your forces a bit away from bots, allowing the other team a chance. But if the team controlling it works together then all is well.

Ejectors: These are amazing at clearing stymies(sp?). Another form of area control that if you dont control it makes a very large difference.

Juice: thwarting a juiced foe is very difficult if you are alone. Why should 1 person be able to deal with a juiced person by him or herself? It is a team game, and defending against juiced attacks places that much more emphasis on team work. If you have 3 people keeping a juiced sin off your turrets then GL to the sin.

All of these mechanics enforces team work to take map control and push bots. pushing bots into an area
that the other team controls is part of the game, and those map mechanics are there to make it more than a single objective game.

Yes the final objective is to get bots to the enemy base and then kill thier money ball, but those things add flavor and an emphasis on team work to this game.


I appologize if the formatting or grammar of this isnt correct, for some reason while i was typing this the text box for this forum kept jumping all around and i couldnt really see what i way typing.

The annihilator is a tax on the winning team. Don't pay it and expect to lose your advantage.

Juice is required to break defenses in general. Having juice buying enabled allows the winning team to make use of their advantage.

Besides if you are playing defense you already are 80% of the way to losing, if not more.

Dude, I have figured out to keep money for it. Does not change anything about its behaviour though.

And my problems with Jackbots was not killing them. It is that they reset the botlanes.

And if I am around I try to grapple the juiced players as well. Changes nothing about the nature of it.

This is an easy fix honestly. Play with a team.

Juice: makes it so that you can't turtle up andplay dim city in your base until OT.

Ejectors: stress the importance of having the high ground/map control. Can assist in pushing a bot lane and disabling any pros trying to escort bots on the ground.

Annihilator: tax forwinning team, way to press your advantage, and a way for a losing team to gain your footing. Arguably the only acceptable death ( hitting it while losing to save the money ball). Also, as an assault with lots of money, it helps me hunt down enemy pros as their health bars show where they are.

Turrets shouldn't be an end all to the game making it impossible to push into a base, making juice a very useful mechanic. As it is right now, only gunners and assassins can effectively kill level 3 rockit turrets, and without juice a pub team without one of those killing turrets would basically be guaranteed a lose.

to be honest it sounds like you are just whinging about the game cos you are in need of practice, yes nothing spawns whilst the jackbot is out, so what, it is not like the bots just explode as soon as a jackbot appears, also getting juiced is a reward for killing bots and shooting turrets and is vital for taking down turrets fast especially if they are being healed by support at same time. As for buying juice, totally fine anybody from either team can buy it and it has a timer so juice control is just another aspect of the game. Ejectors are awsome, if you are in a place with an ejector and you notice the button is green then be alert that someone may press the button, it really isnt that much of a pain.

Rage less. Have fun. Try to realize why they're there in the first place. Knowledge is power.

I follow your points. But I don't think it holds up with only 6 players (at most) on the teams, give or take those who are waiting to respawn at any given time. And with a class that can move, to a large degree, unseen and with great mobility.
Even then I think its a unfun effect to have a button click kill bots for you. I would love to secondary objectives give you a more subtle advantage. More/harder bots spawning fx. Would also give more constant meaning to and fight over the points, than those small periods of time around the triggers being active.

You simply cannot maintain control over the use of the triggers to a point that validates their presence as secondary objectives with such powers. Imho ofc.

Sure you can: lock them into their base with a beastly contain.

They will not be able to do anything with all those triggers outside maybe 1-2 smart players that attempt to hit the annihilator.

After reading your post, it seems like a case of bad teammate syndrome. If bots were the only concern, there would be no reason not to run Tank or Assassin. Juiced players are laughable with two crowd control classes taking care of them; the reason they are so deadly is because people run away, the worst thing you can do unless you don't have map advantage (which you should have because they are coming to you).

All that is excluding juiced Assaults. There's nothing you can do against them, but at least they can't do much to turrets.

I am far from raging. Well I know I am not, and I don't think I made any statements that should lead you to that conclusion.

I would perhaps say I am slightly disappointed.

I would appreciate if you gave your opinion for why they are there.

It is not like I don't grasp their use and won't use them to my teams best effect(or he other teams worst effect) when possible. I don't need to know why they are there to understand that.

I just think that they make the game less rewarding overall by their presence.

are you serious, juiced assault can take down a turret with grenade launcher very fast indeed

Yes, a single turret. Tank, Gunner, Assassin, Support can all take out multiple turrets with a single juice with little to no effort.

Maybe a single level 1-2 rock-it? A Gunner can take down two level threes and still have time for pro cleanup.

So are you saying that yes, the game has these issues - unless you play on an organised and drilled team. Or?

(Excessively simplifying for effect, I know. But so was the comment, I dare add.)

6 players pr team give more of a value to life per say. when 1 person dies you lose ~16% of your teams presence on the field. Which can swing the favor of a battle immensely.

And i would have to disagree. it is entirely possible to control the ejectors on maps.
The classes are designed to be able to stand alone, but thier capabilities are not limitless. When the classes come together and are working together they compliment each other to a very large extent. 1 person cannot hold the ground alone. but a team can.

I believe all of these issues can be resolved with team work. but in order for that to occur either 1 of 2 things need to happen. Either 1, MNC would require much better chat capabilities, and an overhauled voice chat system. or 2 playing with people you know and are on vent, TS, mumble etc.

MNC is a team game, the current social system just doesnt exemplify that.

If you can do that, can we agree that the game is decided anyways?

And thats my point somewhat. With only 6 players on each team, establishing control over multiple specific points in mid map positions cannot be done to effectively prohibit access.
With the kind of swings the number of players gives, you can at most formulate it as a a very loose intention in your strategy. There is still a good chance they can be used against you even if you manage to take up position on them.
Tactically they are as interesting as wall hacks.

As only a slightly related side note:
If I remember correctly, the people behind Global Assault, a game with gameplay that has quite a few similarities (not saying they are the same), said that their statistics showed that a full 10 man team had a 3-1 odds on winning if they were up against 9. All other things being equal.