hand to hand fight units

Discussion in 'Backers Lounge (Read-only)' started by v41gr, March 23, 2013.

  1. v41gr

    v41gr Member

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    would it be cool if you can make robots wit a lot of health that carry two plasma swords; jst like the zealot in SCII; it could be great.
    [​IMG]
    also; i would like to kow if an aerial troop carrier, land troop carrier and naval troop carrier are planned to be make
    thnx ^^
  2. AusSkiller

    AusSkiller Member

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    I think you'd find most melee units are pretty ineffective outside something like StarCraft. StarCraft gets away with it because the individual units are the most stupid units I've ever seen, pretty much all of them lack the intelligence required to shoot and move at the same time making it viable for melee units to reach them. In an RTS game without retarded units that can't shoot and move, melee units become useless because the ranged units will just run away from them and kill them at the same time. It would also make them hard to balance, if they are balanced against mobile units then they will be way to powerful against stationary defenses that can't get away.

    BTW, I do love StarCraft 1 & 2, but the units in it are the bane of my existence, you can't leave them alone for a second without them finding some way to **** up what you want them to do ;). In HOTS I'm stuck trying to get an achievement on a mission where I need to shoot down some flying units before they get away, the units are so stupid that they try to kill everything other than the OBJECTIVE units first so you have to manually make sure they attack the OBJECTIVE which isn't easy when you need to do the same thing in several places at once while microing another group of units to try to get the achievement done, it feels too much like I'm babysitting the "special" class, except that kids in the "special" class would be much smarter ;).
  3. v41gr

    v41gr Member

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    ^^ it's true that units in SCII are sometime really stupid
  4. bobucles

    bobucles Post Master General

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    Melee units aren't necessarily bad, but they require a LOT more animation work for each unit.
  5. igncom1

    igncom1 Post Master General

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    Is a flame thrower a melee weapon?

    Because I'd love some.
  6. iampetard

    iampetard Active Member

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    We had Pyro in TA and it was a very cool flamethrower robot, I hope to see something similar to him again!
  7. v41gr

    v41gr Member

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    pyro is a nice idea ^^
  8. Loegi

    Loegi Member

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    In a RTS with the scale of this, I don't think it would be that easy for them to actually reach the enemy then, like has been pointed out by the Starcraft II units being stupid reference.

    So maybe make them quite a bit smarter and more specialized? Some sort of stealth thingy that allows them to actually get close to units that know how to shoot things? Or a short range(in comparison short range, just enough to evade a firing range) teleport thingy, or a charge?

    Also, +1 for flamethrowers.
  9. bmb

    bmb Well-Known Member

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    Mobile bomb units could be said to be "melee". So it can work.
  10. igncom1

    igncom1 Post Master General

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    A punch so powerful it causes an explosion, killing it's self?

    Yep, in love! :lol:
  11. Devak

    Devak Post Master General

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    I'll say just one thing on this matter:

    there's a reason the swordfight became obsolete
  12. rabbit9000

    rabbit9000 Member

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    Depends how much damage you're doing and how much you can avoid.

    If melee attacks were a one hit kill, it would be worth the associated risk and cost values
  13. mushroomars

    mushroomars Well-Known Member

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    TA/SupCom fans I've found to be generally heavily opposed to melee combat because "It doesn't make sense." A lot of them make the argument that you would "be doing as much damage to yourself as you would to the enemy."

    It's really lame. I want punchy robots. And flamethrowery robots.
  14. v41gr

    v41gr Member

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    hand to hand units would have a lot of HP; and would deal a lot of damages too; more than a basic "infantry" unit
  15. rabbit9000

    rabbit9000 Member

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    Yeah, awesome Uber-tech flamethrowers!

    Does nobody remember Pyro's in TA? Selective memories.

    And filling air transports with punchy robots and dropping them in your enemy's base and watching them set to work on their energy would be hilarious. Or heck shooting them in from a unit cannon.

    I have to stop dreaming up cool stuff for this game or I might end up disappointing myself. :cry:
  16. igncom1

    igncom1 Post Master General

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    Generally If you can have a combat shield, either like a knights or a energy shield that doesn't insta die when shot, and you have a melee weapon that can insta destroy an enemy's shield.

    Then they are a good idea.
  17. bobucles

    bobucles Post Master General

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    A unit that sacrifices range gains power. RTS 101. That's literally all there is to it.

    As long as the Comm can mop up these extra strong units, it's all good.
  18. Devak

    Devak Post Master General

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    But a melee unit doesn't make sense. There's no other argument than the Rule of Cool.

    It adds nothing to the game and it doesn't make sense from an immersive POV.
  19. igncom1

    igncom1 Post Master General

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    How so? If it is faster to destroy an enemy unit by cutting up rather then shooting it, then you would have a greater incentive to use a melee ranged unit.

    Your argument is based on how currently ranged weapons are superior to defences like body armour, but if things were the other way round and body armour could deflects few hundred bullets then a sword would inevitably be a good idea as a way of killing an opponent who can't be effectively downed by ranged fire.

    That's why warhammer 40K has things like chain swords, because defensive technology is superior to ranged technology, so short ranged chain swords are the best and quickest way of finishing an opponent who would otherwise escape.


    So that's why I suggest flame-throwers or possibly oven lightning guns, short ranged high damage weapons designed to cut through heavy armour opponents who would otherwise escape or even win a ranged fight.
  20. bobucles

    bobucles Post Master General

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    Notice how I didn't say anything about melee units. I only mentioned SHORT RANGE units.

    40K melee weapons exist because variety demands it.

    From a more serious angle, Space Marines are painfully expensive troops. They rely on GUARDSMEN to fight major battles. SMs do the high priority missions, where covert strike teams can do massive damage and strong leadership can rally weakened troops. Indoor environments and and crater marked trenches are where such troops can use their massive melee strength to excel.

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