Designing matchmaking for non-gigantic communities

Discussion in 'Unrelated Discussion' started by cwarner7264, September 7, 2015.

  1. cwarner7264

    cwarner7264 Moderator Alumni

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    andreasgg, stuart98, xankar and 2 others like this.
  2. Clopse

    Clopse Post Master General

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    Yeah some really nice ideas in there. The load screen game is the best one. I think PA needs more accessible stats and scores for the 1v1 ladder to be used more. Show us the numbers!!

    What kind of game mode could we use? Maybe reptarking(gandalfs) race game could be fun. Basically fastest time around like 45 second track would be perfect.

    Possible @reptarking? To make a mod, top scored and accept button to that screen?
    Killerkiwijuice and stuart98 like this.
  3. wondible

    wondible Post Master General

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    Might also help to surface when a match is immediately available in the out-of-game UI. Or add play ranked match to the server browser - though you might have to hide the name to avoid bias.
  4. Killerkiwijuice

    Killerkiwijuice Post Master General

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    We don't need player profiles because we have PA Stats... but damn it would sure be nice to have an in-game UI scene for players.

    If that was done, i'd play ranked all the time.
  5. tatsujb

    tatsujb Post Master General

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    we can't content ourselves with score alone and PA stats rating isn't shown by the player name. as it should be. But it wouldn't be worth much without game count. and why not throw some other stats in there. there's certainly the room for that and a lot more. PA hosting UI is just godawfull. I can't accentuate how badly they wasted screen real estate.
  6. knickles

    knickles Well-Known Member

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    Nice read, but I feel like having queue timers, like smite did, is a more effective solution than everything he mentioned. Especially for mobas
  7. arseface

    arseface Post Master General

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    I don't like automated matchmaking. It removes choice, dehumanizes opponents, creates an emotional scapegoat for losses that's unhealthy, and is just plain too much effort to make work in way that is both actually good and perceived as good.
  8. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    automated matchmaking simply is about providing a competitve player a system that gives him access to equaly challenging players .. that is the idea at least ..

    for anyone else that just wants to play for fun there are the costum games ..

    the general thing however is NO ONE likes to play against bad players .. for the simple reason of them potentionaly ruining your experience damaging the overall funfactor of the game over time
    which depends on the size of the playerbase


    what a player generaly wants is a consistent fun/enjoying experience from a game .. which doesn't neccessarily have to mean 100% of the time even if desireable but simply above average .. otherwise why continue to play it ..


    as the dev in the article stated there are a number of ways to keep up that level of enjoyment regarding multiplayer be it through matchmaking, dynamic play during multiplayer downtimes or more planed and organised multiplayerevents such as tournaments ...

    while automated matchmaking is just one way it is still non the less neccesary to keep a playerbase even if only for a specific type of player ..
    why? to communicate to potential players that there IS a playerbase in the first place without people needing to always have to wait in the lobby for hosted games or waiting for players when you host your own ...
  9. arseface

    arseface Post Master General

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    Players can do that themselves, better.

    Dedicated competitive servers can do that. Player run leagues can do that.

    And more than that, those things can provide experiences that people are looking for outside competitive. Automated matchmaking can only try to make fair games with a formula set by somebody else. Encouraging a lack of control is unhealthy, both players and game communities.

    People should be encouraging features that make it easier for them to take control of their experience, not take it away.
  10. Quitch

    Quitch Post Master General

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    As a single button push whenever I fancy a game? Tell me more!
    MrTBSC and cdrkf like this.
  11. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    again thats why custom games exist ... so there IS clear control of choise ..

    stuff like dedicated servers however split the overall playerbase .. as a developer you don't want that .. you want ONE BIG number of players to show to other potentential players to join into in the form of number of active players ..
  12. crizmess

    crizmess Well-Known Member

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    As you are a bit late to the party with matchmaking already in the game I assume that this is a discussion more on a fundamental level.
    So maybe we should separate issues here. This is not about matchmaking it is about the question of how much automation (in form of exterior control) is acceptable.
  13. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    if we take PA as an example i dare say it gives more than enough choice for both automated matchmaking in the form of 1v1 ranked and custom games ... you are not forced to play 1v1 ranked ... so the question of weither or not this is acceptable should be a no brainer ...

    actualy a better question for automisation in PA's case would be if 1v1 realy was that good of a choice for it ... and maybe not shared team games or ffa? ultimately one has to ask what is the most appealing of PA actualy and weither or not it is worth to focus automisation around that ...



    considering the article though the question for automated play rather is: do the games that have a small playerbase offer enough to make waittimes between multiplayergames less obnoxious ...
    Last edited: September 8, 2015
  14. arseface

    arseface Post Master General

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    You'd be right. We're in off topic, so I figured it'd be fine to voice my general opinion on the matter.

    The idea that people should be able to play whenever they want, and have access to players whenever they want is something I think actively contributes to the death of many video game communities. And the volatile, spoiled shitfest that is many successful ones. I can understand wanting to play whenever, and I can see why people perceive that as mutually beneficial.

    It sets up unrealistic and unsustainable expectations if communities dwindle too low. When people stop being spoon fed their computer-cocaine they'll go elsewhere for it.
    It discourages interaction between players beyond what's necessary to play, which is the foundation of forming a lasting community.
    And you know what that article said about split communities? An automated queue draws people away from custom games, even when the player might prefer something else.
  15. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    why shouldn´t they have access to the player base?
    if they don´t then that simply means there is no playerbase to begin with ... sry but that doesn´t make much sense
    and playing agaist ai can give you only so much until you move on anyway ..

    otherwise what do you wan´t to say? that the competitive side of the community shall just piss off so just only the casual customplayerbase stays?

    that competitive players shall be forced to create their leagues themselves?

    also people who don´t want player interaction won´t do so regardless ... those who want will set up/use the available means for it ..

    the backside of the coin will be players who constantly have to host/create their own matches may have to wait longer until they get a player, there is then the risk that the match will be uneven due to experience or skilldifference .. many things that can lead to frustration causing the player to play less as it damages long term player experience ..
    in that case they may just go play something else ..

    automation helps specific players which are mostly competitive or those who want a quick game or 2
    it won´t help those that chose to not use it .. even then if the playerbase isn´t there which in fact the majority is casual anyway then that simply means the game wasn´t good enough to keep its playerbase or players reached their fill already .. automation or not ..
  16. Clopse

    Clopse Post Master General

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    Can the ladder get some love, or make the numbers available that somebody can give it some love and make a mod. So boring playing when you have no idea what your score is or how many points are needed to go up that one space that seems like 20 wins to get but 1 loss to lose 5 places.

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