Couple of thoughts on conflicting changes

Nothing really new.

Patch 8

-Pro change:The turret changes don't match with the juice changes. Yes roflstomping happens but not as fast due to the turret change.

-Conflicting Con: However matches grew long because of the combined juice change. Turrets being relied on more. Tapping the moneyball and retreating is viable for a win. Matches are always max time. OT is rare but for the wrong reasons.

On the other hand...

-Pro change: Juice health reduction and damage reduction. Promotes team juicing and makes it easier to defend against juicers.

-Consequences: Assassins role diminished as well as juice potential. Gunners become important to the point of it being mandatory to have one.

Patch 9

-Pro change: Server stability fix

-Con change: Moneyball health reduction leads to quick games within 3 minutes. Pubstomping ensues. Turtling becomes harder but the reliance on competent gunners becomes troublesome. OT is juicefest. Competitive play becomes troublesome and drys up.


Ideas on fixes

-1 Return old MB health
-2 Only go into OT if there is not a great enough difference between the ball healths.
-3 Return Juice strength

Variation on idea three: Return Strength but not health.

Your thoughts etc.

I agree about the MB health and OT change suggested but I have kind of grown to like the new juice

A juicing enemy does not always mean I die now, but I can still regularly get triples/quads when I juice.

I absolutely despise the new MB health, however. I once played a game where one minute from OT everyone built/bought juice and avoided combat and the only reason we won was because we had 2 sins on their MB and they had 2 assaults on ours. zzzzz

OT isn't so much a JuiceFest as a SinFest
There's been a rediculous number of times I've seen people switch to Sin in the last 30 seconds just to shuriken the MB without much fear of being killed

Depending on the player/server settings, they could easily have $1600 saved up to fully upgrade a Sins Passive/Cloak and buy Juice

I am extremely guilty of this.

I main Sin and I don't like the new moneyball health. All I need is one good juice to take the moneyball down. If I don't have juice I can keep it down indefinitely because it takes less than 30 seconds to respawn, get to a position where I can fire again and put more shurikens into the ball. Other players are purely optional at this point. And if overtime goes on for more than 30 seconds all Sins and Assaults on both teams are sleeping.

The biggest problem with the change is that the other team can do little about it. Once the moneyball goes down there is almost no way to stop an experienced Assassin to take down the moneyball. I feel bad when I do this because I know how it feels if somebody does it to me.

This tactic was hard to counter before the MB health was nerfed, now it's a lot worse.

You don't even need an experienced one, you just need one that can manage to get across the map in time. It's even easier if the defending team isn't top notch

i do this
although i dont upgrade any assassin skills
anything over the 500 needed for juice goes into either a lvl3 rockit or shave ice

I think you should probably buy at least passive 2 for the clip size upgrade on the shuriken launcher. That was on passive 2, right?

Yup.

should/could but not really needed with juice plus all gold endorsements
one way or another its all over in 5 seconds

Assault and bomb jump across the map? :shock:

love doing this when the other team thinks they are gonna win when they have you contained *bomb charge jump* then win and watch the rage, i made almost a whole server empty from doing this, oh the joy

I'm not saying that the juice changes have no merit. I've grown accustomed to them as well but I believe that juice should be a bit closer to previous levels so that the assassin and assault juice are not as diminished.

Base turrets now take a bit more killing power but team efforts should be rewarded.

Assassin's juice is pretty diminished (forcing most good sins to use it as a heal and spam shuriken while backpedaling), but assault's juice is still one of the most destructive in the game... to pros anyway. Even with gold RoF, his juiced grenade launcher isn't going to destroy more than one Rockit so his turret destroying potential is pretty limited--but isn't that where assault is supposed to be weak?

I have pondered that for a while and I think that the assault was meant to be "just" so good at killing turrets. He is all around; very capable of pro killing, good at bot killing, has great mobility, great moneyball damage and is moderate at turret killing. He is, like the gunner' at an advantage with turret killing as it is with the abillity o attack from a good range.

Though it would be nice if I could kill one level 2 rocket and at least get a chunk out of the other.

he is a more mobile gunner, the assault in my eyes is more of a "HEY LOOK AT ME" class that can also kill people if given the chance, he can kill bots, prevent people from healing, get ejectors, kill the ball and take out some turrets from better angles then a gunner and be safer when doing so (turrets like longshots and lazerblazers) thats how i see assault.

I agree with the weird angles position on turrets as if there is a base has every turret nub up then the gunner will have to put himself in harms way to kill turrets protected by other turrets or in corners.

A team that is dumb enough to let a Gunner get into good position unscathed deserves to have their turrets wiped out. :lol:

Actually no. Mortars can hit every turret without the gunner being hurt by any of them.

If the enemy team kills you or not is a different story but looking at the players at the moment...