Assassin Smoke Bombs SHOULD Counter Freeze Traps

As it stands every class except the assassin, has an AOE weapon that can deactivate freeze traps. (mines, mortars, grenades and air strike.)

The assassins only area effect skill is the smoke bomb. Yet it has no effect on traps.

To balance this, perhaps assassins should be allowed to use smoke bombs to get out of traps. (because they cant smoke bomb them at range)

That way, the sniper is alerted of their presence but they BOTH have a fighting chance.

Lvl 3 traps immobilize AND disable all abilities including an assassins grapple. Not to mention the snipers grapple that has ring out and OHKO capabilities.

Thus making the already superior at long range sniper, superior at close range against an assassin. (nonsense right?)


P,S, I can understand why snipers would disagree but its all about balance.

Id like to know what you all think.

I can kind of agree with this, but it needs to be moved to the suggestions forum.

By having to use a smoke bomb, the assassin has given themselves away to the sniper and uncloaked themselves. Should it be only after trapped, or should there be an AoE around the smoke bomb to disable the trap?

If it is only after the assassin has been trapped, perhaps using the smoke bomb removes the trap effects but doesnt allow them to jump. Basically the smoke bomb jump power is 'absorbed' and used to clear the trap so the assassin is left standing.

There would need to be some delay after clearing the trap so assassins could not just run straight through traps.

Wait, wait, wait.

I like this idea. I've always wanted an option to destroy them as an assassin. If the smoke bomb stuns bots and turrets, how about also disabling traps, if at least for the same set time?

No, don't use them to escape. If it got you, it got you. It's all about rewarding your forethought for spotting the traps with your eyes in the first place, not finding them with your feet.

If no one knows you're there, it's up to you to take your time and spot traps to plan accordingly.

What about giving smoke bombs a "confusion radius" when you upgrade it to lvl 2? This radius should be about 10m wide and disable traps for ~10 seconds. I say lvl 2 because the snipers traps get useful at lvl 2 and we need a reason to upgrade the smoke bomb, I rarely upgrade it and if I do it's only to lvl 2 because there's no real reason to use it besides an occasional high jump. It's also a long animation and bug sometimes.

Good input, but there is a reason why I believe it should be to escape.

Think of how unpractical not being to escape would be.

Every other class can disable traps, from range and the entire radius of their attack is used not to mention also attacking the sniper.

For the assassin and the non offensive smoke, that has a lot of impractical application.

FOR EXAMPLE: Once the traps are spotted, the assassin MUST drop down and/or walk up to the traps to use smoke. (walking up to traps is how you get trapped. lol)

Also, at that point, they have to visually measure the circumference of their smoke grenade AND the traps. (Both of which are invisible. lol)

And lets not forget, only half of the smoke bomb radius can be used because at the midway point, stands the assassin. (3 traps, separated by a foot or two and the smoke wouldn't be able to reach more than 1 maybe 2 of them)

Thus making the assassins presence know to all nearby enemies and\or turrets prior to an attack. And oh, the sniper doesn't have to wait to throw down more.


THAT is why it SHOULD be to escape. That way, the assassin remains in stealth. (which is the point of the class)

Don't get me wrong, it may need tweaking on both sides. (So more discussion is appreciated)

But the Assassin has to get close to disable them. Its not possible to see exactly where to drop the smoke prior to engaging and enemies can hear you cloak so you wont have forever to sit and measure.

By making it a response, combat remains fluid and no one has an advantage.

Thoughts?

The smoke bomb does have a radius, maybe have it so it doesnt get your out of the trap, but if the trap is in radius, it destroys the trap, before you even hit it.

This actually isn't true. Most weapons don't work worth crap for destroying sniper traps and bombs. I have yet to be able to destroy a trap with gunner's minigun or mortar. I am not even sure smoke bomb has enough range to reach the trap without setting it off.

I think a better solution would be so all weapons can destroy traps and deployed bombs.

Edit:
Went and did some testing to find out exactly what can destroy traps.

Can destroy traps (not necessarily in a realistic situation):
Assault Bomb
Assault Grenade Launcher
Tank Product Grenade
Gunner Mortar
Support Airstrike

Can realistically be used in game
Assault Bomb
Support Airstrike

The Grenade Launcher and Product bomb are something you will pretty much never be able to use to destroy traps intentionally. In testing I would take 10+ shot into a cluster of traps set up specifically so they would explode in close proximity to the traps. I more had to aim the traps to where the grenades went. You might accidentally blow up a trap while aiming for something else with these skills, but you will never intentionally disarm a trap. The main issue here is that you cannot aim directly at the trap, the grenade or product bomb has to finish bouncing and come to rest at the trap.

The Mortar fairs a bit better than the grenade launcher and product bomb. However, the aiming is still tricky on flat surfaces and sometimes downright impossible on angled surfaces. You are probably looking at 3-5 shots with practice. Not really all that reasonably usable in game. Slam does not work at all, I did test it.

Airstrike is fairly easy to destroy the traps with, but only works when the traps do not have a roof. Also, you cannot aim the airstrike to clip traps under bridges. You need to have the trap relatively towards the center.

Bomb is the best, but it was unreliable at level 1, it didn't start to get useful until level 2/3. It runs into the same issue where a trap near the edge probably won't be disarmed.

When you disable a trap using one of these items it explode like it went off.

So there are 2 realistic ways to take out traps, one of which is on a character who isn't the best sniper hunter. In fact in most scenarios you are better off just trying to airstrike the sniper with the support.

Also of not, the assassins charge attack (reload with dagger/sword out) will trigger a trap, but continue until the charge runs out of distance and then be frozen in place. If a sniper is sitting on top of his trap is it possible to charge to him and immediately grapple for the kill. Once his trap is level 3 this is no longer an option.

Traps are the Sniper's only answer to Assassins. If this were implemented, the Sniper would be ridiculously vulnerable to Assassins. An Assasin could simply smoke jump, cloak, land exactly where she jumped from, and front-grapple the Sniper for the kill.

Assassins are not entirely the "answer" to snipers.. most of the sniper's abilities are to counter assassins.. Traps and theyre insane throw grapple is easily the best counter to Assassins, Snipers have no counter, lol.

Yeah, every supposed counter is not full proof. Death blossum reveals assassins but not guaranteed to kill them. Tank charge can close the distance on a midrange assault but of course, is not perfect. Support's shotgun can wreck an assassin where she needs to be (close range) but not always easy.

Hmmm, but as far as I can see, the only thing an assassin can do do a sniper camping his traps is to shuriken. Fair and balanced? Up for questioning. But traps sure are a pain in the *** to deal with.

Ok, ok, so I can always think outside the box to deal with it, but I'm allowed to bitch and moan, right?

If I'm not mistaken, the trigger radius is the same regardless of level right? I'm pretty familiar with seeing traps and if my smoke bomb were to work, I personally think it's feasible. Eeeehhhh, I know as an assassin, escaping from traps benefits me, but something about ruining the concept of being punished for walking on top of a usually obvious trap doesn't rub right with me.

Or atleast make it so ice traps doesnt put grapple on cooldown, this way snipers shouldnt come up to you and grapple, as by design ice trap is to keep your enemy away from you, you shouldnt run up to them.

I agree with the OP, it reveals the Assassin's position alerting the sniper but the assassin still has a (small) chance at getting away.

I think you misread my post. I never said that Assassins were the answer to Snipers. I said that Traps were the Sniper's only method of dealing with Assassins.

You could always jump over them.

Not true. As a sniper, your grapple is excellent for assassins. In fact, as a sniper, your frontal grapple is deadlier than the assassins. lol. If the sniper survives the frontal grapple, he can just return the favor. There's no way an assassin can return the favor. They're either falling to their death or on the other side of the map...

Btw, if you smoke jump from a trap, your grapple is on cool down. Assassins still wouldn't have the advantage up close , just a fighting chance.

And the topic doesn't eliminate traps, it gives the assassin a counter to them. Snipers ridiculously vulnerable to assassins? Right now, the "close range" Assassins are "ridiculously vulnerable" to the long AND close range snipers. Is that fair?

Which adds even more to the reason. You say some of the classes means of disabling traps aren't dependable. Look at it from the assassins perspective, at least they have one. lol

When? If the sniper is standing in the middle of the three traps, landing inside will just freeze you closer to him. Heck, the sniper can stand directly on top of them if he wants.

The assassin has NO answer for the traps.

Oh...I didn't think if that.

I guess I can say I am glad I am not an Assassin player. :|

Lol. It's still a fun class. Honestly they all are.

We're just trying to help make it an even better game. ya know?

You misunderstand, I am not saying they "aren't dependable." That implies they can be realistically used to deal with traps. I am saying they are so bad at dealing with traps and circumstances have to be so perfect that you can't even consider them a method to deal with traps.

Product bomb does not make the tank better at dealing with sniper traps than the assassin. If you successfully take out a trap with product bomb in a real match, it is a downright miracle.

How often are you able to grapple something you can't see as a Sniper? I don't think the Sniper grapple is a valid counter to Assassins on its own. It has to be used in conjuction with traps in order to be effective. Also, even though the grapple is on cooldown, the Assassin could just come back later when the grapple is back up in order to attempt the kill again. Allowing Assassins to jump out of traps transforms the traps from a hard counter into an equalizer because you don't automatically beat the Assassin.

Also, front grapple immediately followed by a lunge should instantly kill a Sniper. I'm not sure if you can get the lunge in before the Sniper gets his grapple in, though, so that's something we should check out.

Also, I really dislike the idea of "exceptions." A while back, LoL introduced a "static cooldown" to a single ability in the entire game, which meant that this static cooldown ability was the only ability in the game to not be affected by the cooldown reduction stat. Although it helped balance the ability, it was very negatively received because it was an exception to the normal mechanics of the game, causing confusion.

Smoke bomb jumping out of level 1 and level 2 traps would not be that bad, but definitely not level 3 traps due to the skill drain effect. If the level 3 trap makes you not able to use skills, an exception should not be created to allow the Assassin to smoke bomb jump out of a level 3 trap.

Reaver

I'm glad you brought up exceptions and the fact you say that they shouldn't be. Thats a great word for this discussion. Because right now EVERY class has a way to disable traps... But the assassin is the "exception".

Which we agree, shouldn't be.

And I personally have grappled assassins. Once you see them, face them. And yes, you can grapple them while they're lunging, especially up close.

An assassin can come back later, yes. And just as well a sniper can put more traps down later.

And as you said, its an equalizer because you don't automatically beat the assassin. Don't know if you realize but, thats a good thing. Every class but the assassin has an "Equalizer" to the traps.

Snipers already have OHKO with headshots at range, why should they have two? No one else has two. They must be the "exception". lol (now I'm just having fun with it.)

So in conclusion, allowing assassins area effect to disable the traps doesn't create an exception, it eliminates one.