2019 Air Balance Thread

Discussion in 'Balance Discussions' started by Killerkiwijuice, March 15, 2019.

  1. Killerkiwijuice

    Killerkiwijuice Post Master General

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    (public balance idea spreadsheet https://docs.google.com/document/d/1chSwBLnPT5q9lhM6wIGqt06uuSJoyCr70WynJbnBaBo/edit?usp=sharing )

    This thread is for serious and organized discussion about air balance. Balance can be highly subjective so solid data is encouraged but not required. This will be one of 5 threads.
    I want the threads to foster intelligent discussion about balance that people may have, and they will require people to post: (you can include multiple changes in one post, but this thread doesn't encourage large reworks)
    1. Your vision of what the unit or category of units should perform on the battlefield
    2. Exactly what you want to change about the unit or group of units
    3. Why you want to change this unit
    4. How you think your change will impact the battlefield
    5. (optional, yet highly desired) data showing exactly how the new changes affect balance
    For clarification, these and only these units may be included in proposed balance changes: (Obviously, you can still talk about other unit interactions, like how spinners are ground units but they only shoot air. But spinner changes are reserved for the ground thread) Ignore legion units.
    https://palobby.com/units/table/air?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/fabrication_aircraft?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/fabrication_aircraft_adv?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/air_factory?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/air_factory_adv?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/air_defense?version=titans
    https://palobby.com/units/unit/air_defense_adv?version=titans
    Last edited: June 30, 2019
    NikolaMX likes this.
  2. Killerkiwijuice

    Killerkiwijuice Post Master General

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    T1 Air Fighter:


    1. T1 Air fighters should be fast air units designed to deny bomber raids and fend off other air armies. They should protect friendly air units and be the backbone of early-mid game air forces. They should be able to be replenished quickly and should not snowball.
    2. Missile ammo speed reduced from 150 to 110.
    3. Previously fighters would snowball very quickly given large differences in unit numbers. This change allows small fighter blobs to out-micro larger blobs.
    4. This change greatly reduces the amount of air snowballing. Allows players to get back in the air-game with good and consistent micro.
    xankar likes this.
  3. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    1. icarus should take a bit more part in the early air part of the game as it basicaly sees no use at all, have them be fabber hunters and maybe borderline capable to raid undefended basic mexxes without stepping into the area of the t1 bomber being the primary offensive unit ..

    2. I propose a speed, a rangeincrease and a slight damage increase ...
    speed form 30 to 75,
    range from 70 to 80 ..
    damage from 25 to 35
    the recent change of the icarus having it be a gunship may help surviving a bit against a doxpatrol ..
    otherwise maybe increase the HP by 10, from 40 to 50 ..

    3. this unit sees no use at all despite potentionaly being a precisiontool for harrasment compared to the AoE damge that the t1 bomber does

    4. what this hopefully would do is to enable the icarus as a viable early game harrasment option that requires a bit of micro but it will still be vulnerable to interceptors as it is slower and lacks the range to get of the first shot in a engagement, not to mention that it lacks the firepower to quickly deal with them, as a fabberhunter even with the damage increase it requires 2 shots for a botfabber, however against vehiclefabricators this would cutdown the neccesary ammount of icarus to 2 shot a vehicle fabber from 4 to 3 which could be a reasonable investmeant .. dox should still be able to deal with the icarus based on metalcost and spinners destroy them outright ....
    Last edited: March 15, 2019
  4. Killerkiwijuice

    Killerkiwijuice Post Master General

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    Wyrm Rework:
    1. The wyrm should be used as a ground army killer, or a titan defense. It should be able to tank lots of AA, even flak, and deliver its payload. Currently its speed prevents this.
    2. move speed: 20 -> 50
      acceleration: 10 -> 20
      surface and underwater vision radius: 200 -> 50
      ammo capacity: 1500 -> 4000
      ammo per shot: 1500 -> 1000
      ammo demand: 500
      ROF: 2
      damage: 5000 -> 1500
      splash damage: 5000 -> 1000
      splash radius: 20 -> 15
      turn speed: 110 -> 60
      bank factor: 0.25 -> 40
    3. This unit is unused by good players. It has no role in the air game, because it dies far too easily to ground AA.
    4. This change will make the wyrm a viable mid-late game solution to ground army destruction. It can be used as a strategic bomber to quickly destroy even moderately protected ground armies.
    5. Videos

    huangth, xankar and NikolaMX like this.
  5. huangth

    huangth Active Member

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    I hope to buff Angle and Hornet.

    Angle cost is just too high, 5500 metal,
    but its repair speed is only 120 metal/sec.
    This makes Angle very unworthy to build.
    I hope its price can be reduced.

    About Hornet, I hope it can counter orbital units.
    Currently, it is the only long range missle units which is unable to attack the orbit.
    Bluehawk, stingray, and Catapult all can attack the orbit.
    I have no idea why Hornet can't.
  6. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    hornet should not counter orbital it´s too mobile compared to the other AO options ..
    rather either the phoenix or avenger should have been one suborbital superioirity fighter capable of attacking air and orbital ..
    i agree with a pricedecrease on the angel ..
    Last edited: March 25, 2019
  7. Clopse

    Clopse Post Master General

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    The wyrm looks really cool. Seems like it could be op with micro? Like stop it over commander/ high value unit other than flyby.
    huangth likes this.
  8. MrTBSC

    MrTBSC Post Master General

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    with current ballance you need 3 of them to oneshoot a commander, compared to 5 ssx ..
    huangth likes this.
  9. huangth

    huangth Active Member

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    I still think it is ok to allow Hornet to anti orbit.
    It's quite expensive and difficult to spam.
    And it's fragile to common air fighter, player can always use Phoenix to sweep Hornet.
  10. Killerkiwijuice

    Killerkiwijuice Post Master General

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    The AOE is so large and the damages are so similar that stopping them won't make much of a difference. But it still may be an issue. They're so expensive though that you can scout them long before they finish building.

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