How many resources upgrades will we have in -PG /ME(power generators/mass extractors) Will we have 3 techs or just 2? We showld be able to swap bar menu from, down bar to right ,and the right bar to down,or any other order bar. The units upgrades and fabrics could be a bit moore simple on the read, but iff will be only 2 techs probably its ok like it is.. ex: Engenier Vehicle t1 /Engenier Vehicle Advanced t2 /Engenier Vehicle Advanced t3 Bot Engenier t1 /Bot Engenier Advanced t2 /Bot Engenier Advanced t3 Engenier aircraft t1 /Engenier aircraft Advanced t2 /Engenier aircraft Advanced t3 and same for the rest off ground air and naval. Energy Production/Mass production I don´t now what about Adjacency_bonus, will we have or not, but iff we will have , the energy and extractors scale need to be fix i guess the Height and Width. I think its not ratable to the rest of the structures.
Re: Tech upgrades and Adjacency_bonus ive seen this argument like 5 times now can we please find a way to get it out there that we are not doing upgrades and from what i have heard from uber we are sticking with two teirs with T2 being extremely expensive to use frequently
There is no in-place upgrade planned as far as I know, and adjacency is definitely out. I really do think in-place upgrades of mass extractors needs to be a thing. Unnecessary for factories/pgens though.
Adjacency bonuses are counterproductive, especially in PA where there is no grid form which to judge adjacency. Direct were not in TA, so they will most likely not be in PA. T3 will not be in PA because it invalidates T1 and T2, which is a waste of a lot of good code and art assets. If you want to play SupCom, play SupCom. If you want to play Total Annihilation with explodey planets and stuff, play Planetary Annihilation.
Re: Tech upgrades and Adjacency_bonus I thought T2 was supposed to be "specialised"... Not just expensive :?
There will be no upgrades and no adjacency bonus. This is not a sequel to supcom. For a game of this scale if T3>T2>T1 then T1 and T2 units and buildings would never be seen as you have no doubt noticed when playing on large maps in supcom. By having a viable T1 and a slightly more specialized T2 then T1 has a place in your composition throughout the entire game.
Re: Tech upgrades and Adjacency_bonus For many units it is. For stuctures though its simply "More powerful, but more expensive". Having only two tiers with T2 being very expensive but powerful makes T1 stuff remain useful as quick filler stuff.
Re: Tech upgrades and Adjacency_bonus So T1 has a specialised role for "Starting Up" and "Space Fillers" and T2 Eco structures are actually "General Use"? Honestly the whole T1 / T2 situation is so backwards and flimsy at the moment it's causing me real concern. The idea of Specialisation vs General Use is getting sacrificed in the name of "TA-Style". I'm going to say something a little crazy here but; Total Annihilation didn't do everything right y'know? Note to self: Have to re-post my old thread on this topic...
Re: Tech upgrades and Adjacency_bonus I was assuming we'd get something in the vein of T1 power: fusion reactor T2 power: cloakable/radar invisible fusion reactor T1 metal: metal extractor T2 metal: armed metal extractor (has built-in turret / more HP) Which follows both the T1 not being obsolete late game (they are cheaper / quicker), and T2 specialisation paradigms. You could even go one step further with "disposable" T2 economy structures; cheap, quick, massive drawbacks T2b power: half T1 cost, half T1 HP, double damage on explode power gen T2b metal: Half T1 cost, quarter T1 HP metal extractor Tactically viable if you don't expect them to last long, or it is an uncontested area (cheap generation vs defensibility) I can see why the alpha is currently playing this way (the whole "T2 is an upgrade" is pretty built in to the genre) but I was also looking forward to some twists on unit designs / abilities to promote the T2 specialisation-over-plain-upgrade.
You could also have some of the more specialized structures from TA/TA Spring community unit packs. I remember Balanced Annihilation had the Twilight, a cloakable "T2" mass extractor that cost more. Problem is, you can't really make every T2 Structure "specialized". It's difficult. Just making it more volatile, bigger, and more efficient isn't really doing much.
Im just feeling this got a strong and big amounted off ideas,but its went to a totaly diferent way that i was expecting when i see the trayler and buy , TA SC and the forever love FAForever that we just can´t stop play,its still on my mind,hope in future some 1 released a game thinking on ower comunity. I think its time to me, start think in this game like when Supreeme Commander 2 was out, a game that got nothing to do with TA/SCFA games,its just another game,like K-Zero that by some reason got some things we have here.
Right now I sometimes use T1 units as specalized counters while keeping T2 as my main damage dealers once I get my economy big enough to spam T2 units. So It's kind of backwards.
+1 specialization vs general purpose posts, it is harder to follow that guideline with resource production but it's possible. everybody agrees we should follow that guideline for units but we should follow it with structures as well for all the same reasons. I like the idea of armored/cloaked or in some other way less vulnerable MEX for T2. Meaning they have a specific use in contested areas. Right now the eco seems like it's headed towards the exponential SupCom style. The mass "investment" war in SupCom had dubious value for gameplay at best. I do want to give Uber a chance to develop their underlying unit designs and balance before I begin criticizing though.
Just played another game where I got steemrolled by a mob of levelers. I think the biggest mistake is making T2 units that are just bigger versions of T1 units with better stats. Crazy idea but, what if the T1 units actually had more HP than T2 units, but T2 units had longer range or special abilities? T2 units would be more strategic, if you send them in alone they will get wasted, but if you can put a wall of cheap units around them, they can turn the tide of battle. Balance advanced units by making them more fragile and specialized instead of bigger versions of basic units.
This actually was the idea settled upon during early development. A lot of games adopt a similar approach including StarCraft, CoH, DoW and many others.
Yeah, I hope the game lives up to that as it develops, and that Levelerspam is just an alpha artifact. I could see Ants becoming more important once mass points become a thing. You can't just expand your economy forever, so you can't afford to spam T2 units. Also they could make the Leveler a "heavy" tank instead of an "advanced" tank. Make it slow so smaller units can outflank it, and give it less vision range so it's a sitting duck without other units to spot for it. While I was at work today, I had some ideas however on how to make T2 units not just better versions of T1 units. T1 Fighter: Uses machine guns. It will chew other air units to pieces (if it can catch them) and can harass ground units, but it's got **** range. T2 Fighter: Uses long range missiles, of which it has a limited amount*. It can one-shot just about anything in the air, but T1 fighters will ruin it if they can get close enough. T1 Bomber: Drops bombs T2 Bomber: Fires anti-radiation missiles instead of bombs. These missiles are longer range, but can only target ground and sea units with active radar (Boats, Radar structures, Spinners, Anti-Air turrets) Not very useful by itself, but capable of opening up a path for T1 bombers. T1 Mass extractor: Extracts mass from mass points. T2 Mass extractor: Extracts more mass from special "Deep" pass points. These points can only be accessed by T2 Mass extractors. T1 Generator: Can be placed anywhere, Generates energy. T2 Generator: Can only be placed on Energy points in a similar manner to Mass Extractors. Generates more energy. *Assuming something like SupCom's air platforms for refueling and rearming air units are introduced.
