K/D farming forumers.

Assumptions arent nice.

Having all 5 enemy pros waiting outside the spawn doors completely ignoring the downed moneyball was what i was talking about.

You can easily pin down all three doors with a gunner/assault or two and maybe your support's firebase (while he hurtguns the ball). The rest of your team should be on the ball.

Also bots dont "rape the ball", they kill it horribly slow.

Welcome to Monday Night Combat.

I'd like to see a single game where the underdog came back and won in this situation. It's extremely unlikely. Spawncamping makes it almost impossible.

Also, if you let me juice off a level 1 LazerBlazer, you can be sure that I'mma be death blossoming in your base. It's punishment for someone on your team being a complete tool. Stretch and I played on Spunky Cola yesterday, and we just kept camping a level 1 Lazer and juicing them. If it weren't for those 2 Gunners, I would've chain-juiced 5 or 6 times off that one turret.

I also got a sweet spawn kill on LazeRazor yesterday. I was Tank, and 4 enemies came out of their spawn, essentially trapping each other. Charge 3 + a death blossom takes out all 4. I lol'd.

Got nothing against chain juicing off of LB's, helps teach people not to build them, people start to clue in after the 10th or so juice in the chain. Also getting juice off LB's isnt a glitch, its working as intended (or was at least an oversight)... from what ive heard at least.

I already mentioned that spawn camping when used as a strategy for winning is perfectly fine and legit. But when used as a K/D padding machine while your whole team ignores the objective (moneyball) right next to you is just disgusting.

Imagine just how many new players/trial players would be completely upset by that and would not play MNC because of that?

I know if my trial games consisted of getting spawn camped while the enemy team drew out the match as long as they could, i would have probably dismissed MNC as a bad game and left it.

An online game's community is a part of the game itself.

The LazerBlazers thing is completely intentional, the devs have stated it.

By your logic, I'd call it a strategy.

Your team is controlling the enemy, meaning they can't even get outside, not to mention build a turret or push bots. Your bots have a continuous stream into the base, and wreck the Moneyball quite fast. Bots do more damage than non-juiced Pros, so if it's a strategy, you're better off locking in enemy Pros.

Not sure you can argue spawn camping is good for one reason but another not.

Unfortunately the player who is only focused on k/d who spawncamps is coincidentally also increasing their teams chances of winning. Whether its an intentional "winning" strategy or just a byproduct of their greed, in both cases the enemy team is being pinned in the spawn. Which if that, as you seem to believe, drives off new players then it would seem those using it as a "legit" strategy are as much a part of the problem as the k/d farmers.

Unless of course every new player to the game conducted an exit survey after each match asking the other team "Now did you spawncamp me out of strategy or for stats?". However, I'm fairly certain that is not occurring.

Personally I have the same opinion that its a decent strategy but a lame occurrence when done out of stat farming. However I realize that since I can't distinguish which is when and that in most cases people are doing it for BOTH reasons, I've come to accept it as just part of the game.

What these arguments are failing to get at is the obvious failure of the spawning system in MNC. There need to be either A: More exits or B: an ejector that will remove enemy pros from the spawn area, is expensive/long cooldown.

After reading those last few comments, yeah you got a point.

I like these ideas. However both of them feel kind of... tacky?

Gah, cant find the right word for it.

It would be neat if there was a solution that fit in more with MNC's style, just adding on exits or throwing in another ejector (albeit a special one) feels kind of cheap.

Maybe thats just me.


EDIT: Maybe a second spawn hub that you can teleport to from the origional one (expand the origional spawn to fit in a teleport pad), that way in order to completely spawncamp you they would have to have two different locations under lockdown, alot harder to do then just one.

Another spawn door, like one that drops you down to the lower level, would be awesome.

Ian, I played a game not too long ago where I was on a team, joined late, our moneyballs had maybe 15-25% health. I helped build turrets, we held back the opposing team till overtime, then I had juice, wrecked their moneyball, another class came with me, everyone else stayed behind defending and within a minute we destroyed their moneyball and won. It was an amazing comeback game and I was so happy to be a part of it :3 And that sentence is huge and stupid but I'm don't care about my English at the moment xD

On topic, I still think anyone who tries to defend K/D or spawnkilling are just protecting their egos. I've played with a few people like that and when THEY got K/D farmed or spawnkilled themselves, my gawd, you have NO idea how much whining went on. No one likes it happening it to themselves but they love doing it.

That's not a bad idea... I don't know if it would help much if you're already pinned in your spawn though.

I think there need to be as many exits as there are players on the other team.

Maybe a jump pad in the base that would send you outside of your base behind the spawn killers.

IDK. If I start getting camped, I will taunt in the spawn until the next round.

If the next round has the same results I will find another room.

I don't have a problem with kill farming. No problem whatsoever. There's an excellent reason to do it that I never hear people mention:

-It's the fastest way to get better.

I'm not talking about spawncamping. I'm talking about going for as many kills as possible while keeping the game going as long as possible while still pulling out the win. This gives you the maximum amount of opportunities to fight pros in a given match, and fighting other pros, more than anything else, is what makes you better.

If the other team is no match for my team (I mostly play by myself so don't accuse me of constantly pub stomping), I'll try to keep the other team's turrets by the base up and go mostly for kills and steer clear of their base for the most part. I see this as a win-win for both sides. Everyone gets to play longer and in turn gets more in game experience.

From my experience, you can only get so much better from attacking bots and turrets and going for fast wins. What can really turn a game around in higher level competition are the player-versus-player matches. Is it a team game? Certainly. But slaying is important too.

So if you see me in a pub game racking up kills and keeping a game going, please understand that I'm trying to improve, not degrade you. I'm also giving you not only a chance to win but an opportunity to get better.

Yeah when spawn camping was first "discussed" about this was the only feasible fix, imo. I mean we seen they can make slight map changes already with spunky.

Expand the size of the "cloning helmet" from the back, add a lower level with the same door pattern as the top just back a bit (not directly under because jump pads are there) and add a jump pad inside the spawn so you can got back up to the top safely.

I think it would extremely help spawn camping as well as pushing away to restore your shields.

"If it was that easy don't you think we'd have it in the game already?"

WHINERS GONNA WHINE.

Jen, that's not helping. If you've got nothing to add, ignore the thread. Spawn camping is a real problem and we've talked about different exit designs for upcoming maps.

How about addressing the lazer blazer issue that makes juicing and spawn camping so easy? I see a lazer blazer, I automatically see a juice machine that I can continuously use to kill folks as they come out of their spawn.

OT: I'm down with multiple spawn exits.

Something else that could work would be a lift to the top of the spawn, where you could drop down onto the spawn ring. No enemies can get up there so that seems decent.

How about, instead of spawn doors, the spawn is a walled circle with 6 jump pads that lead to various starting positions, with an open top? Or three, and three holes to drop down out of the base?

They actually kind of have. The PC version seen a nerf. "Reduced the amount of juice Lazer Blazer turrets give to deployed Tanks and taunting Pros."

Sure you could argue that this is only for the PC but you could also argue that they are using the PC to test possible balance changes for the 360 since there is no wait time to release patches.