"Oh, good. You're setting up a tur.... SHAVEICE? REALLY?"

First off, taking what I said out of context. Yes, saying "no they're not great" was perhaps not the best wording, but I did continue to say they're great in conjunction with something else.. I'm not trolling, I have no intention of enticing flaming. I wanted to create a discussion focused on frustrations involving poor timing with perhaps not the best turrets for the situation.

I don't believe a RockIt turret would stop a pro, far from it. A pro is better handled by another pro. I think the RockIt turret would be well suited to help with the bots, who still deal a fair amount of damage to the money ball. Having to focus on not only the pros, but the bots as well is a lot on the table, especially when the shields are down.

You're also assuming that I don't believe in defending the base. I play two primary classes. Gunner, and Support. As a Gunner, I'll admit, I play largely offensive. As a support, I do nothing but defend. I stay inside the base keeping turrets up, and try my best, often alone, to avoid the base from being overrun. More often than not I play as support to keep the base safe, this changes when I believe the team I'm playing with is capable enough that I can venture into an offensive role. This isn't because I want to, this is because there are more players who prefer to rack up kills than there are ones who want to put effort into a higher likelihood of winning.

A ShaveIce turret is not a very suitable in a chaotic situation next to a money ball when pros are bearing down on you to help with the bots. A Longshot is most definitely not suitable in that situation either. A LazerBlazer is a waste of time unless you can upgrade it, it'll be destroyed by any pro who looks at it or a small handful of bots. The RockIt turret has enough health and can deal enough damage in a suitable volume to assist in a fight. If you have the money and the moment, however brief without dying, the RockIt turret is the better choice compared to the ShaveIce.

Something else you should understand, this ShaveIce in question. The only reason I questioned it was because it came during a large battle. We had nothing, but maybe a brief breather between the carnage. It was put up, then torn down. It changed nothing. It was destroyed by Pros before bots even got close to it. A RockIt Turret wouldn't have helped much. Fire out two rounds at most before it was destroyed, but it would have hurt them. The long and short of it, a ShaveIce did less for the team than a RockIt turret would have.

I like your doomsday scenario >.>

"What's the best turret if I'm going to lose anyways?"

The truth is, pros who are slowed down because of the ice turrets will be killed a lot faster than lasers or rockets.

I didn't assume I was going to lose, I don't do so until the money ball gets low and the game had just started. I was thinking about killing the pros, and setting up something of a defensive perimeter. My team pushed them out eventually and ended up going on for a while longer. I can't say I recall if we won or not, but it was never about a us losing and what to do in the meantime. It was about what could be done to not lose. Setup a ShaveIce was not on that list of possibilities.

I disagree with what was put down, but I'm don't know if was their intention or not to set down a ShaveIce. It might have been a mistake. I saw it placed down in passing, and then didn't see it a few seconds later.

I've got nearly 600 wins playing this game and while it is unfortunate that turrets have their problems you shouldn't necessarily be mad at someone just because they are using ice turrets.

The turrets closest to the ball should always be rocket turrets. There have been too many games to count where proper turret placement (and management) won the game for us. If you've never noticed before, bots usually don't shoot at ice turrets. They walk into their radius and slow down. The next thing you'll notice about ice turrets is that they are extremely durable.

A level three lazer blazer takes 3 mortars to destroy but a level one rocket or ice turret takes about 5 shots. Most people don't build ice turrets, so you might not have ever shot at one that's been fully upgraded. It takes serious effort to destroy one. Before you dismiss ice turrets try placing them in the following locations: right side of Steel Peel near the rocket turret and the forward left side of laseRazor.

Doing so will give your enemies something else to shoot at (and quite possibly give you a chance at blindsiding them) besides your invaluable rocket turrets.

In one of our last few games this evening my friend hacked the enemy's ice turret. I think it was at least level two because the radius was huge. They were all frozen in their own base as we slaughtered them. It was absolutely hilarious.

Bearing in mind your First Post Edit my response won't be just another 'ShaveIce is useful' but something more obvious and less helpful: People are stupid. Don't rely on them to build your perfect base plan.

You don't need a Shaveice turret to detect Assassin's easily.. unless your ear's are bleeding intensely and are unable to hear. A lazer turret would be much more helpful in my opinion. I play as an Assassin, and i walk through Shaveice turrets all the time, and 99/100 times it doesn't effect the outcome, i still kill whoever i playing defense on their team. Shaveice will only help you beat and detect horrible assassins, which you won't need the shaveice turret in the first place to kill a horrible assassin.

I can't say I was really all that mad at him, more frustration. I was with a friend and we were going up against two level 99s. Intimidation being what it was I got frustrated and made this topic after that fight because of what happened. Really, it would have been more useful elsewhere, when slowing down the bots would be more significant beyond them stepping that one foot a little slower before they jumped onto the money ball. Again, it was just that there could have been a more constructive use of that money and that turret nub.

What is far more frustrating is seeing a teammate use up two turret nubs to place Longshots next to the moneyball repeatedly. This was really the reason why I made this topic, because I was curious if there were other people out there who experienced this same level of frustration.

@OptiMAT: I don't expect anyone in my party to build the perfect base, and I don't really expect much from your typical pick up party in crossfire. Common sense is a different story entirely. And again, the ShaveIce thing was a small part of the equation that got blown out of proportion.

I find looking for that Predator glimmer or hearing the humming to be far more useful of a deterrent to an assassin. Also more cost effective.

That first location, is that the one that a opposing sniper can see from it's own base? That's a nub that should not have any kind of turret.

Its good for spotting out those pesky ***assins that camp at ur base.

I agree with Veras, the only time Shave Ice should be made in that situation is if you have enough for lvl3 right away and a support nearby to hack it, or someone else started building a damage turret before you started. Otherwise do lvl3 lazers/lvl2rockits please people.

To begin with the problem with steel peel is that snipers can shoot turrets from the safety of their base. However, note that I usually play on a team (about 2 other people is good). We always have someone playing support and our star support player is very good. He watches over our turrets and gives them an overcharge when he dies.

My strategy on Steel Peel is to take over the area where their upper level jump pad terminates. I'm near impossible to knock off of that position; the last time I took it I bested 3 snipers with my mortar to take it (they weren't so safe behind that glass). Bear in mind one of those snipers had just gotten over 30 headshots on grenade III in the previous round. From this location I can rain hell down on any sniper trying to shoot at the turrets on the right side of my base (and I can destroy all of their turrets on the right side except one). My friends can easily destroy the last turret, which is almost always a laser blazer. Having no turrets on their right side means they have to spend a lot of effort to kill bots. That's a lot of pressure.

In one sense I agree; why build a turret there at all? Assassins can sneak out and buy juice. That's one hell of a good reason if you ask me. Having forward ice turrets greatly reduces the possibility of a successful approach angle (or often makes them think twice about it).

My strategy on steel peel is to veto it.

I like to set up shave ice turrets just to show I don't need a defense.

I try to too, but i usually do not have enough people to agree with me.

By the way, i was with 6 players yesterday, and it said we needed 6 vetos, is that correct, if so, why?

You mean you had a party of six, or there was a lobby with only six people?

If the lobby had only six people then it should have been less than six to veto. I've never seen the veto level go below five, but regardless if it was staying at six then it sounds like a bug.

I wish more people did this. It seems like most people just quit the lobby when they see steel peel. If they'd just veto instead we could keep playing.

A lobby of 6 people out of the 12 possible. We needed 6 vetos (or 5, not sure), but i figured it had to be 3 (or 4 if you want majority like MW, which i believe is not the correct way)

Yeah in my experience it's six if the lobby is full, then drops to five at something like eight or ten people in the lobby, but doesn't drop any more than that.

Have you level 3 hacked a level 3 shaveice turret before? It BLANKETS the entire base.