The sniper

It might be a radical idea, but I wonder.....

Would you lose more players by completely removing the sniper than you already lose due to rage at the snipers?

doubt it
if fact i think most players would enjoy the game much more

But then the 2Pro4U Kids will cry. We don't want that.

If there is going to be a nerf to the Sniper, it is going to be his rifle. Touching anything else would be like fixing the ornaments on a Christmas tree while it is on fire surrounded by dickwolves.

Priorities.

yeah, snipers like draket and tibolan are incredibly annoying to deal with. Its just out of no where, oh... I'm re spawning. I guess I got my head clicked on.

I wouldn't mind removing sniper then re balancing. I also wouldn't mind a charge time being added to the sniper. Bolt action wouldn't be the right medicine imo. It would still allow those shots that ignore the other players skill. If anything were to be done to sniper, it would have to put the sniper in a position where his attacks cant completely remove the other players skill.

just my 2 cents.

I feel that the Sniper in general makes no sense in MNC based on the gameplay, but would removing headshots go a long ways in making the Sniper less gamebreaking?

He shouldn't of been in the game from the start, makes no sense like people of said to the type of gameplay.

double grapples are the only reason I play sniper. I hate the stupid rifle.

My adjustments:
*Modify the scope so you can adjust zoom
*Include damage drop off, so the closer you are the more damage you do, However reduce the damage drastically for long range.

At the moment, the sniper is the only long ranged class in the game, and the other 5 classes are oriented to close/medium range. The gameplay for sniper right now is low risk high reward, this is because he can instantly kill any class from long range. However, other classes take risks in their gamestyles as they have to get closer to danger to do their duties.
Every single class has a OHKO mechanic (except the tank). However, the sniper's is too easy to pull off and as a result, headshots are a lot more common than they should be.
*Gunner's Pancake -requires you to get close and personal and if you manage to be able to pull this off as a gunner you deserve the instant kill
*Assault's Headcrab -requires a skilled throw of a projectile that you can only use every so often
*Support's Ground Zero- another skilled throw, however easier to avoid because you can throw more.
*Assassin's Backstab- Requires a lot of balls to pull off, most of the time results in your death afterwards (if there are more people around)
*Sniper's headshot- Point and click, done. Any range.

The sniper can't be touched by most classes because he has range in his favor. More range is less risk. However, the closer you get the more risk you take. My adjustments orient the sniper to a more mid-close range class just like the rest of the classes in MNC, having an equal chance of dieing just like the rest of the crew. At close range, pulling off a headshot is a lot harder, and it will actually feel rewarding. At this range, his traps and grapple can be used more offensively instead of what they are used for right now

Then why call it a Sniper at all? I would prefer the opposite, though the rifle itself needs a nerf of some kind as well.

REMOVE SNIPER

(Witty and relevant face)

WHINE ABOUT HOW OP HEAVIES ARE

so much of this.

seriously. He accels at CQC even though he is a wimpy "i need to be all the way in the back" type of killer who is also weak looking?

Oh wait, lets not forget the quickscoping. Why bother letting him zoom in at all? Just convert his gun into a railgun from quake lol

Only if the sniper is actually good. Most snipers have a very hard time to counter my gunner and if at all only kill me with a lucky headshot.

The only snipers who can counter me with very little problems are the known ones (Hentai, Tib and verden for example)

But I never usually stay in the back when I snipe, I like spawn camping.

thatds true too.

well, dont worry about the spawn camping thing, but it's the whole concept of sniper that doesnt make sense when he is LEADING the charge.

A sniper out in front with freeze traps, cluster F* bombs and no scoping headshots is not how snipers should be.

Hiding in the bushes, in the back, zoomed in with traps near them so they dont get snuck up on. Thats how a sniper should be.

But no, he is running in the front, no scoping headshots and CQC'ing people out of the ring.

Just give the guy a jet pack and the tanks charge while you're at it.

just played a server that disables sniper. It is the best server out there now.

I don't play Sniper much but I think the SMG has a smaller crosshair than the AR

I feel like all I do is defend the sniper, I'm going to put it in writing...

I only play sniper, and there is only one reason I do this. Sniper is the class that requires the most out of the user, and has the least reliance on anyone else for survival, other than maybe assassin. They are not useless when it comes to winning the game, but the skill required out of a sniper to have a positive impact on the outcome of the game is exponentially higher than any other class. The penalties for small mistakes are also exponentially greater though.

I feel like snipers are balanced, not OP, and they can be extremely annoying to a team without an anti-sniper presence (which really just requires somebody halfway decent focusing on the sniper).

I don't think the change ideas given here would be very helpful for the only real downside that exists with snipers (they're causing the community to shrink). If I was limited to having to shoot twice at most players in the beginning I'd still kill them 90% of the time. When I shoot somebody in the head it's not chance, luck, odd, random, or anything like that, it's good placement and timing, muscle memory, it's pretty dependable, 85% of my total kills are headshots. If all I have to do is shoot your body after I shoot your head you're still dead. This happens with tanks right now and the only annoying aspect of it is that I don't think I get credit for the first headshot in my stats (anyone know if thats the case or not?). I'll still be hurtful to the community, since I'll still retain 95% of my kills. Now if the other part of that is getting rid of explosive bullets I would almost agree with that. I don't really think snipers should be able to push bots like they do with the explosive rounds. The penetrating bullets are nice though, I usually keep my sniper upgrade to lvl 2 just because I feel the explosions are a bit questionable.

The charging scope idea is interesting but I again don't agree with this alone. It would completely eliminate quickscoping, and with that eliminate the ability for snipers to be aggressive and offensive. Most people that get annoyed with snipers get annoyed because they're way away in the base protected and they just camp around killing people without anyone being able to get to them let alone kill them. I don't do this and the great snipers in the game don't but some mediocre snipers do and get high k/d's and cause lots of annoyance because of this. If this change were to happen the movement and awareness skill requirements of the sniper become null and the entire game would be boring to me, I would leave MNC.

If the 2 ideas were meshed together, where the skill upgrades would diminish the effects of the second idea so you have to earn your quickscope ability. It would add another interesting aspect to the sniper's gameplay and help allow people to get better positioning earlier in the game, but it would be helping the steamrollers. I've been the sole force in stopping a steamroll countless times. I'm not sure what Uber's motivations for this are since they've had updates that both helped and hurt the ability to steamroll dramatically. The problem with this though would be that it wouldn't help the people who got annoyed, I'd still kill them, they'd still ragequit. I'd just have more fun doing it since mastery of the sniper would be an even more complex task, which is what drew me to the sniper in the first place.

Traps are not essential for great snipers, if they're gotten rid of then it'll just make fewer people able to play sniper, but we'll still be around, pissing you off.

Adding a waver will be very similar. Many people will be unable to get kills with the sniper, but we will. I guarantee if you know the name of a sniper in this game then this is not his first computer game, and he's probably been good at a game with a sniper waver. All it causes is a more complex timing scheme. Some people may sleep better at night knowing that shot that killed them was "earned", but most wont care, they still died. Again I think this would be fun to have, but you're not going to like it once we get good with it again (probably like an hour worth of playtime we'd have it down).

So far of the ideas I've heard the one I like the most after thinking about it for a while is sonny dove's idea, but I don't think Uber can do this, it would require changing what MNC is all about. The idea is to change the level designs so that they're not so open, so that a perfect line of sight is not possible for 90% of any of the locations on the map for the sniper. The reason this isn't possible from Uber is because MNC is a spectator sport set in the future with arenas where the crowd watches the gameplay. If the maps were closed in, had lots of walls, twists, turns, things like that then the crowd wouldn't be able to see anything defeating the whole storyline. What we need are mod tools, then we can make maps that will be less annoying for people who hate dying to sniper shots. That way the players that hate me can be shot by me point blank and blame themselves for their deaths instead of Uber.

Personally though I think this would just change the game into more of a TF2 feeling game, just with bots. The openness is part of the feel of MNC. The snipers job is to thin out the people, keep them out of bot lanes, keep them from getting juice, save the assassins when they don't realize people are getting ready to kill them. People get mad because there isn't much you could have done about the death a good sniper caused, but there's not much a sniper can do about the death an assault caused, other than kill them, which is much more difficult than assaults think.

In reality every class has situations where they can't really help deaths sometimes, but thats why the respawn time is so short, if your team is good your death probably won't even stop the push. I can't really feel bad for people like sonny dove, memorable, fitzgerald, Gray Fox, a few others on this post and nearly every assault on the top 50 kills list (what maybe 30 of them right?) because they are getting annoyed by what they're doing to everyone else, killing them in ways that have no possible retaliation or method for stopping. Want to know the method I use to keep Fitzgerald from killing me? Pray. Thats right, I'm an athiest, I ******* pray to Jesus Christ, Allah, and Thor Simultaneously in an attempt to keep from dying. Lets just say I've not converted yet, been playing for 7 months.

This game is difficult, there is no getting around that, it'll never have 30,000 players on simultaneously because of that fact. It's not the snipers fault the game is difficult, though he is one aspect. The reason I love the game so much is it's difficulty and complexity remind me of the old games I used to play on the PC before the masses played video games. I don't have a problem with only 50 players on at a given time if they're awesome players and the matches are amazing, which they tend to be when the numbers dwindle. We don't need to be trying to get the mainstream into this game, we need to get the best of the best fps gamers into this game and show them how deep and complex the gameplay is. This is a game specifically engineered for competitive play, we should do a better job organizing this type of play, everyone needs to find themselves a clan, play with them, play against other clans, thats where this game will really shine and live forever.

Anyone who disagrees is welcomed to play on a server that doesn't allow snipers....thats what they're there for, if there are many people who agree with you the server will get populated.


TL/DR: mod tools are what we'll need to shut you guys up, from a sniper perspective these other ideas would either break the game or have no effect in the real problem people have with snipers. I, and most of you, love this game because it's freaking hard, snipers are one of the reasons.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion and your point of view as a sniper of course will differ from many others.

I disagree with your assessment. Many are leaving this game primarily due to snipers and not the complexity of the game. Those that leave because the game is too complex, don't usually stay long enough to even try to learn it. Many of us are just fed up with snipers.

I haven't seen any servers that don't allow snipers (only assaults so far). I will have to look for these, maybe I will play again.

I'm just going to pay for a server and set sniper to 0 so I have somewhere to play rage-free. I respect your point of view Chris but assault does not deal unavoidable deaths like sniper does. When I can successfully flank a sniper, throw a bomb at his feet, but get quickscoped instantly before I can even detonate it, that is frankly a load of horse manure. And I'm not talking about this happening maybe once a match. It happens frequently when playing against snipers of Tiblolan and Draketh's quality. Instantaneous, rapid, and reasonably consistent OHKO at any range. Broken.