Homefront DEMO beating MNC

It's humorous, that there are people who are agreeing with me that the game has a steep learning curve, yet arguing that the reason no one plays this game is because this generation wants easy game. Then on the other end, I have people arguing with me that the game is too easy and it's not their responsibility to go easy on newcomers.

a well thought out and worthy response

are you saying that because i tried hard through practise to get better at something i was bad at that i am somehow incorrect?

okay, do you think this game has a steep learning curve? if answer yes, then you are a bad player

no one plays it mainly cos they do not enjoy playing it, and also many people suffer from the dunning-kruger effect as i previously stated, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2 ... ger_effect ,

people like hard games, retards who shouldn't be catered to like easy games

your solution is to go easy on bad people, your solution is flawed

Kotay, I repeated this several times, and I'm going to make it in big text so you can read it better

Monday Night Combat was in the top 10 most active games on Sunday and Monday when it was on sale, and now it has sunk and fell off the 100 most active games on Steam chart in less than a week.

because it was like what 2.50 so many people bought it as it is not much money and they found that they didn't like it so no loss

and then a better game became f2p

are you seriously this retarded

And why didn't they like the game? Does it have anything to do with people rage quitting constantly due to every match being a pub stomp? I wonder.....

And it went down in ranks on the activity chart BEFORE TF2 went F2P.....

no they simply did not like the game

other games are more punishing on noobs, ut, hon, dota, sc2, those games have massive following and bads keep playing even if they get stomped constantly, it is nothing to do with anything other than they did not like the game

you think this game has steep learning curve, you are a bad player, get over it

what's your kdr btw?

i suspect you are sick of getting stomped due you to being a bad, and you made this thread to pretend you feel sorry for the new guys but it is in fact just so you stop getting stomped yourself

l2p stop being a bad

ZING!

Official locker room one is 3.6ish. It's so low because I'm an assassin and die a lot because of it.
My penis as a gunner or assault is massive though.

General response to everything in this thread. Kotay is right. This game has a steep learning curve if you are ignorant and require a helmet to go outside. The curve is steep compared to shooters most of todays gamers are used to; run at enemy spray and pray or as is the case with a huge portion of F2P games just buy your rediculously OP gun and win.

As far as TF2 goes; stop kidding yourself and everyone else. TF2 was originally so popular because of Team Fortress Classic; many people had been waiting on TF2 since before the original Half-Life existed as it was in the works on the Quake engine. The game itself was originally to be a more Modern Warfaresque game. After a decade of reworks people finally got TF2 based more on Half-Life's incarnation of TFC, which itself was extremely popular. TF2 is also popular now because of, drumroll, HATS. If not for the ability to grind out items to trade and collect it would be behind the 1998 behemoth Counter Strike. Pubs take no skill what-so-ever and have no learning curve...it is run to the front and shoot till you die; noobs love the fact there is no k-d ratio so nobody can make fun of how bad they suck. I will also repeat, HATS, the main reason people play TF2. More grinding for gear than an MMO.

It was delevoped by Valve, had a huge advertising campaign by valve, was hugely anticipated by the community to begin with, and thusly had a larger and more sustainable playerbase from the start.


As far as SC2 goes; again stop kidding yourself. SC2 is so popular because it is a graphically updated version of the most popular RTS ever made. People all over the world, mainly Asia, still play StarCraft religiously. This is a totally different genre so it doesn't even really apply. The learning curves for an RTS and a FPS/TPS are vastly different. You need natural talent and to not be braindead to succeed and get good enough to hold your own in pubs in FPS games. In an RTS there are simply correct ways and wrong ways. There is no amount of natural reaction time and accuracy of pointing and clicking that will help you. You play, you memorize build sequences, you memorize every single ability and unit in the game, and you practice hours upon hours to hone your micro skill.

It was delevoped by Blizzard, was hugely anticipated by the community to begin with, already had a huge playerbase to draw from because of StarCraft, and thusly had a larger and more sustainable playerbase from the start.

As far as Sid Meier's Civilization V. What is there to really say? This game dates back to the very first personal computer. A game franchise with nearly 3 decades of success under its belt will of course still be successful.


If you are going to compare games make the comparison equal.

Here is an example of what to compare MNC to.

Bloody Good Time. Extremely good extremely fun game. Completely dead game. Why? It is not a standard mindless run around spraying bullets to be the best. It requires you think. Think a lot actually. Loads more than MNC would ever dream of. Indie developer.

Dystopia. Extremely good extremely fun game. Completely dead game aside from a hardcore community that just can't stop playing. Extremely complex gameplay that required tons of teamwork and thinking to even begin to dream of winning. Indie developer.

Natural Selection. Extremely good extremely fun game. Completely dead. This one had some balancing faults as one side had guns and jet packs the other side did not though good players dominated as any of the classes. It mostly was a testbed and it really died as a result of the developers abandoning it and starting work on its 2nd incarnation on new more visually pleasing engines. It was developed on the Half-Life engine right as the newer engines with things like dynamic shadows and ragdoll physics were first coming out. Again required a lot of thought to play, especially as the aliens that relied on ambush tactics to even dream of winning. Indie developer.


The biggest fault in MNC is that it came during a time when gaming isn't just for the hardcore gamer anymore and thus most games have been tailored to hold the masses hand now. When I started gaming, in a time long forgotten, tutorials didn't exist. You installed the game, selected a difficulty, and clicked begin. You then watched a cinematic and the game started and MAYBE if you were luckily it would tell you how to move akin to Halos look around the room to calibrate your suit "tutorial." In the case of RTSs it might have explained what your base units did and where to go to build your first type of building; the rest was up for you to read tooltips and figure out.

I don't see what makes MNC so difficult and why it even needs tutorials. Kill bots, kill people killing your bots, and ultimately get your bots to the enemy base. Seems straightforward to me and obvious the first game you play what is going on. As far as the classes go; if you can't use each weapon for less than a minute and figure out what it is good at and not good at by trial and error yourself then there is no hope for you. If you are shooting a turret with your minigun and it is obviously not doing any noticable damage why would you not switch to the mortar and see if it work better? No harm in trying something different. Oh wait that is trying to learn on your own without being spoonfed; the game didn't explicitly tell me I could use my other gun so I might explode if I try it.

In response to wanting the option to play with AI opponents. Why? How is playing against AI controlled opponents even remotely fun? MNC bots would be the least fun AI opponent ever created because of the nature of the game and the maps; even if you turned the bots on a Godlike difficulty of most AIs where they get wall hack and aimbot precision there would be no way to stop you winning every game effortlessly.

As the newbie I am, I feel obliged to add a few words from the view of a noob.

1) Tutorial:
I played it at least twice. It was nice but not very helpful. More information is definitely necessary.

2) Info:
Whether it is put into a second, more advanced tutorial, a map with bots like at TF2, a training-map or the possibility to "play" as an observer, that's not the point. The point is: There is not enough information in the game itself. Yeah, the wiki is helpful, the community here is even more.
Not long ago I argued in favor of another tutorial. I changed my mind. I do not think that a second tutorial or a third or even more could ever cover the massive amount of information needed. The only source there is: An experienced player. That leads to ..

3) Easier access/lower the learning curve
I'd like to argue in favor of a tutorial system: Add an observer-mode, so that new players can see what experienced players do. Add a testing map where newbies can play a few rounds with one or two experienced players observing. Most of all: Add a chat system that really works and does not break the conversation at every loading screen.

4) Matchmaking and servers
Have some newbie-friendly servers. If there is a 3-star server, no 5 star players are allowed. If there are two level 50 players do not put them in one team. Limit player selection to one assassin and one sniper each team. Introduce levels to each class. A player can e.g. be great at playing tank but bad at playing assassin. This player should not be allowed to play tank at a newbie server.
Last but not least, reduce damage and increase health at the newbie servers.


There are two things I want to add:
First:
I do not like the idea of banning experienced players during a newbie-week. From my point of view -as a newbie- it were better to motivate experienced players to help the newbies with tips. Hey, why is there no "I helped a newbie doing his first kills" badge? A badge given to the mentor when his mentee kills a certain amount of bots/players/turrets/what-not.
Anyway.. with a proper (=working) leveling and matchmaking system banning great players should not be necessary at all.

Second:
Community here is great. Really. Without the help of this forum, the videos at youtube and the wiki I would have stopped playing a while ago.

ARS0N1ST's words of wisdom :O

this is something that would be really helpful and would encourage competitive play

disagree as i think newbies playing with newbies would already compensate for w/e reason you want that. and it'd take extra time for them to get used to the standard when they switch to other servers, kinda pointless

The idea behind it: Not being killed every 20 seconds (mainly by sniper/assassin) enables learning, prevents rage-quitting and that enables learning again...

Gotta disagree with Arsonist on a few points, hats aren't what is keeping TF2 alive. It is a genuinely fun (and easy) shooter for somebody to get into and thats why it got popular and remains popular. I'm not going to sit here and say hats aren't a factor, but if they removed hats people would continue to play the game simply because its an addictive game and chances are, you will always have a few buddies to play with. MNC does not have that fun and addictive gameplay that TF2 has simply because everything takes effort in this game and a hell of a lot of it. While that may be a positive to some people (me) it will make other players say, "Why am I trying to play this again?".

And saying that trial and error is how people should learn to play this game is ridiculous. Some things are obvious enough (Gunner shooting turrets with minigun) but some are not so obvious and have no obvious solution. For example, how is the Assassin supposed to know that she is not built to kill pros when she seemingly has the tools to do it? Or how is a Support supposed to know that you use Passive 3 as a clutch heal or that the hurt gun on enemy bots can save his life? Most classes in this game outside of Gunner and Sniper have roles that aren't clearly recognized in any of the class descriptions which aren't very descriptive in the first place.

Is it really so hard for the game to tell you to upgrade Passive 3 with Gunner first or to note the differences between Level 2 Charge and Level 3 Charge as Assault?

My main point is, why would a new player stay in a game where you have absolutely no idea what the point of your class is yet the game requires you to know your class very well?

If having necessary information given to you by the source is "Spoon feeding" then you are never allowed to use Wikipedia while researching a paper. Go to the library and find that information yourself.

This is something that becomes obvious when you die for doing it.

All the information that is available was discovered because we went to the library and then made a post on Wikipedia about it so that people don't have to do that.

If a player is not willing to get better at a game he should stop playing. Very simple.

Clearly not seeing as most new Assassins don't get the picture. And who goes into a new game with the idea that "Wow the class of my choice may just be totally incapable at killing people"?

Also how the hell is it a bad thing for a new player to continually try and kill somebody after failing so many times? Is it not a staple idea in just about every competitive thing ever that you keep trying until it works? How is a newbie assassin supposed to just know to stop trying to kill that tank when they have absolutely no idea whether or not it is a class defect or they are just doing something wrong.

I know that if I just started out with Sin I would be dying to that Tank until I got it right because I wouldn't have any clue that the sin just simply CAN'T DO THAT!

And having a comprehensive tutorial system will help new players get better so what is the problem here?

a few random thoughts from someone playing fps games longer than i care to admit. i'd like to use tf2 as a comparison as it's a game that shares similarities with mnc and skills from one game translate well to the other.

i played tf2 when it originally released, i'm talking the original orange box here. a few observations why tf2 succeeds and mnc (despite being an incredibly fun game) does not:

1. tf2 came from a big game studio with appropriate marketing and name recognition. this is the only place in which mnc could not compete in terms of visibility or budget.
2. tf2 fostered a mod community, right away. new maps, new mods loads of different types of servers of every flavor. mnc has 1 gametype and 6 maps.
3. tf2 had regular updates that were content, not cosmetic based. the game has been constantly improving. even without the f2p switch it's community was still strong 5 years after release. mnc has several updates, mainly technical in nature and we got a few new costumes.
4. demos. personally, this irks me to no end. just about every fps game since original quake (in 1997!) included the ability to record demos. mnc is based on an established engine and still lacks the ability to make demos. forget about tutorials. want to learn to play tank or assault, go download the demo of awesomeguy in clan whatever during thier last tier match (see point #5).
5. lack of a competitive/league environment. it's not that the game isn't fun. it's that it offers nothing past a pub experience. no mod tools, as stated before, offer no ability to set up tournament type play. lack of demos offer no easy way to show that gameplay.

there are some other minor points which i will omit at this time but those are the biggest.

As a new player, there have been a few things that made me want to quit a specific server:

-People selecting a team preference and all the 70+ level people end up on one team. Stacking teams on a pub server is just retarded.

-Bad matchmaking and that is not the players' fault, but it can still be frustrating.

-New players not listening to advice from better players. This frustrates the hell outa me. I LOVE when people clue me in on things I could do better or a strategy I am not thinking of. Sometimes I still get my priorities mixed up and need to train myself a little better.

The problem is, the pub servers are often 12/12 or 0/12 and that just sucks. There might be 5 3-star servers that are 12/12 and a few 5-star servers that are the same, then a bunch of 0/12 servers. It makes me not want to leave a retarded server once I get a spot in a server that is actually populated.

I have never played TF2, but seeing all the posts saying it is a better game makes me want to try it out.

TF2 I find to be meh compared to MNC. While I like the variety in it, the game as a whole just feels "off". I like MNC way more than TF2.

Homefront only gained a raise in numbers 'cause of the weekend deal.
TF2 is only played 'cause of hats, it sucks you in.
MNC is apparently too hardcore for casuals.

And I get the feeling this has spurred off-topic.

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