Update 8 [5/18/11]

From what I have been reading this seems to happen a lot more now then before.

If it's a single assault attacking your moneyball versus a tank and two gunners attacking the other team's then I wouldn't be surprised.

In all seriousness though OT losses for the "winning" team usually always happen because the team that was pushing all game invested in juice and not turrets. If the support is able to turtle well enough such that 3.3 turrets stay up during OT they have the serious edge vs the winning team's base that still is sitting pretty with level 2 turrets.

Of course keeping 3.3 turrets up should not be happening but you can't always rely on the gunner knowing what they're doing/having the cover they need.

I still like my idea that everybody but one glazed over: viewtopic.php?f=27&t=10176&p=147053#p147053

The problem with that idea lies in the relative ease with which lanes are pushed. Between ejectors and his/her personal weapons a single player can push a lane 100% up to the enemy turrets as fast as his bots can walk. I just don't like the idea of using easily influenced measurements when they can be altered in such a short amount of time.


I actually had a pretty interesting idea while discussing with my friends why the current OT system in MNC is not ideal.

See the problem is that once each team deals damage to the moneyball it is almost impossible to force an OT. They have so much HP that you could play a thousand games and never "tie" the moneyballs to go to OT (other than a stalemate situation). This is the difference between MNC's scoring system and other sports... in football or basketball you have a score which increases based on a set system of small, predefined increments. 1/2/3/6 points at a time etc. Using this scoring system the teams can easily determine what they need to do in order to tie up a game or go for a win, and tactics reflect this. Go for a 3 pointer to pull the win or play it safe with a 2 point layup to force OT? That kind of thing. In MNC, however, you can't really go for this type of play because the health of the moneyball is up in the tens of thousands or something, and you really can't define the actual score of the game.

I want (mod tools) to make a gametype where you score a point for dropping the moneyball. You can't damage the moneyball during the game... you can only drop it. It stays down for 30 seconds and then the shields would go up again. You get one point for dropping the enemy shields, and the team with the most number of points at the end of the game wins. If bot teams dropped the shields of the opposing team's moneyball an equal number of times, the game will go to overtime (like usual) and it is a race to kill the moneyball (or do the most damage before OT expires).

The above idea isn't bad. Not bad at all.

For reference though, I have played probably 1 game ever (on pc or xbox) where the moneyballs both dropped and recieved damage, and the game ended in a tie. A literal tie. As in 2 minutes of overtime, where the balls had damaged but even health in the end.

That was great. I was like...

Example of new OT

daztora: Why aren't you leaving your base?
randumdood2k11: we hit ur moneyball y should we?

GG

Coupled with the fact that juice doesn't wipe a base as quickly as it used to, and you do have a problem.

TBH, I sorta dislike both these things in the update, but they make things slightly better than they were before.

MY OPINION: Mandatory overtime again, and give juice 3x damage and 2x armor.

I am glad that nobody goes without skills before buying juice now. Why waste $500? Brilliant.

have you not seen a juiced support shooting the moneyball? shotgun+airstrikes=OMFG BALL IS DEAD

and yes gunners lack of knowledge is sad, not just the character btw, the people playing him mainly but he can push a team off, i did it last night, we were stuck in base, we got a push, bought juice, destroyed some turrets and people, bought juice again, did the same and we ended up winning because of that push, but the rest of the game was just a turtle in base

Only problem with this is that this game type will equal 'Turtle More'. You know, to make sure the ball will never drop.

Isn't that how most pubs go these days anyway? Super defense... oh look they dropped our ball gg. If anything I think it would give people a better reason to be aggressive (or at least that is how I would play the gametype).

I was also thinking that after either team's shields drop all bots on the field are destroyed, so that one team doesn't just keep dropping the shields every 30 seconds. This would basically reset the bots to meet mid-field and give the defending team a chance to rebuild their defenses.

My idea for update:
~Comprimise on the juice nerf. Make a juicer able to destroy a turret, and still be more defeatable by an enemy like they are now.
~Get rid of the overtime change, that was just forum whining, and now that it is changed it led to more forum whining.
~keep the lvl2 turrets at the start of the game. Awesomeness. Even though I used to take advantage of weak turrets.
~Keep lazorblazors as well. Awesomeness. I just wanted to point out that I overall did like the last update, especially pretaining directly to turrets.
~New Feature: It has been said many times, but when the shields are dropped, it isn't realistic but mandatory for better balance... could the losing team's bots become stronger or the winning team's bots weaker? There are a few pros and a LOT of cons for a losing team to have weaker bots, and a support using them for juice is one of the only pros.

I agree here with probably the exception of the bot idea. I'm open to it but I'm not sure. In theory I could see how giving the defending team a chance to rebound easier.I just don't know though.

Off topic: Bro do you use Internet Explorer?

Yeah, I doubt that happened. You were accusing our team of turtling in a game once after we slapped the ball a bit, but we weren't.

I always play normally no matter what state the game is in anyway, and the changes have been great. I've noticed the losing team gets far more aggressive and team-orientated when their ball is in the red, and people are far more willing to splash their cash for better turrets.

Why turtle anyway? You get less money and less map control.

It wins the game.

Not... quite...

It wins against disorganized players.

It is easier for disorganized players to turtle, you just stay in one area, mass-heal turrets, and fire some rounds from cover.

It is harder for disorganized players to break turtles. Attacking individually doesn't break turrets as easy as healing individually.

However, you ever turtled against a team with a competent pair or group of players? They probably gunner boost for juice (or buy), drop airstrikes at the same time as mortars, and juice assassin cloaks in and juice-slashes up the supports as the mortars go down. Pounding, cost 500-1000 to destroy 2000-3000. Turtling still doesn't win games unless they probably werent going to win anyway.

Exactly. Even one decent gunner with a little backup can destroy a lane of turrets.

A lot of times when a team appears to be turtling, it's not intentional. It's just what happens naturally when one team controls the center of the map but doesn't keep pushing well enough

^

That is an observation I agree with.

When I find myself being locked down from proceeding it is a constant fight to down players and bots. I can see how from an outside perspective defending turrets and not being able to proceed beyond the base might seem lazy.

Yeah it did, not with you.

This is another problem, couple hundred people playing the game you always run Into them, you could effectively forget about annoying people on TF2 and the like, here you will run into them again.

This Is what also has put me off.

@daztora

I don't think you're bothered by running into the same people. I was there when you didn't run into me that one time so I know it didn't happen that way, so...