Unit Cap.

You don´t get the point, do you?

IF the unit cap would be implemented it would either be implemented in a very poor way (= senseless) or in a very well-done way, which would require tons of fine tuning. (-> tons of work) But even if it would work out it´ll be really hard to find a good value for each system. And with really hard I mean so hard
(remember: A high limit would be worthless, a low limit would restrict players possibilities -> something between is the goal and you´ve got a GIANT range to pick from)

It´s the same argumentation you can use for "there shouldn´t be a Mini-Map in Gothic-Likes":
There are two cases: Either the minimap is essential or it´s not true that the minimap is essential :
If the minimap would be essential world and "Maxi-Map" aren´t enough to orientate yourself in the world in little time-> world design is poor -> world design should be enhanced instead of implementing a mini-map!
Or it´s not true that the minimap is usefull: Then why should you implement one?!

It´s simply not worth the effort! Instead of trying to push out a unit cap, you can invest the time in optimizing the AI or adjusting transportation options!

This would be a tweak at the core mechanics. If the AI got the power to realize "would be stupid to build more units of that type ATM", than this is a huge step forward, as the AI would then stop producing more units. A unit limit would cause something similar, but not the same. Take the "naval in small pond"-scenario:
No tweaks: AI will spam the pond.
AI-tweak: AI would build two stingrays to get good base defense and then switch to build something else
Units-Limit: AI would spam the pond until unit limit is reached, stops them and continues once a unit died!
I guess it´s quite obvious which one is better, isn´t it?
Both tweaks: If Unit Limit is high enough-> AI-tweak; otherwise -> Units-Limit

Oh, and another thing. Imagine that you´ve got a situation in which it would clever for the AI to attack with 1000 Units:
No tweaks: AI would build 1500 units and attacks with 1000 (course the others aren´t the ones the AI needs for that operation)
AI-tweak: AI would build the 1000 units she needs & some general stuff that sounds usefull and attack with the 1100 Units.
Units-Limit: AI would try to build 1500 units and stops at 750 (could be any other value), attacks with 500 (remaining stuff=useless) and dies in pain.
Both tweaks: AI would build the 1000 units she needs, only 750 get finished.

I guess these examples do show pretty well what I mean...

no @radongog .... I'm sorry.

I don't get how you guys could possibly imagine implementing a unit cap could threaten the developpment process/speed/progression/whatever to this degree.

you guys are utterly delusioned.

so nothing ever gets done unless someone just feels generous that day and flies down from the heavens and takes care of primordial UI elements and core game elements, yeah, no.

that's not why this game is "moddable in the first place".

this game is moddable for a ton of reasons, for just about every reason. just not that one. And I find it shamefull of you that you think that of mods.

How is it shameful to think that about mods? that's literally what they're for - to provide players with options, gameplay options, balance options, every kind of option imaginable.

Who died and made you king?

I don't want it myself, but as an option for single player (you did read his post right?) it's completely harmless, and there's no reason for you to think that only your vision matters.

use_mods.jpg
or make the mod yourself
but don't tread on uber
especially for trivial matters like this

It's for Uber to decide what they think would be a good enhancement for the game, not you, so lose a bit of your self importance there please.

I don't needor care for a unit cap, but if it seams like a reasonable thing for enough people, then it's useful, people that think they know what's good for the game and tell other forum members that their ideas are useless do a lot more damage to Uber than asking for a feature in SP.

Asking for a feature isn't treading, it's a customer telling the company they bought a product from how they can make them even happier with that product.

I see a lot of people on here who play only multiplayer games rejecting the idea. This would not have to interfere with multiplayer. Just a simple pop cap option for A.I. and skirmish battles. No harm done to anyone who doesn't want it. There is no reason to not agree with that other than you want to just be a ****.

It's a small enough thing that it's no l

Because I don't want time wasted on trivial things when core features like galactic war aren't even finished. Go download or make a mod for it.

It's not trivial when there is a huge number of people requesting it. And it's a VERY minor quick thing for the team to add. I have an I7 4.5 ghz cpu. Even it gets bogged down into the low 30 fps in AI games. I want to restrict how many usless ships the AI builds in a small pond near their base so the game doesn't crawl. I'm sorry, that's a valid reason.

Your CPU isn't responsible for low FPS, turn down your graphics settings or buy a new card. As stated earlier in the thread, there are better ways to make the AI stop building ships in a small pond - namely, fixing it.

Actually the CPU is responsible, because I have this graphic on my lcd called cpu usage. And this is the crazy part... it's MAXED OUT when my gpu usage isn't. Glad you know everything about my computer though, that's cool. And the ship building was just one of MANY examples of stupid unit count choices the A.I. makes. I agree, it should be fixed as well, but it's much easy to add a drop down box for unit cap in the options for single player games in the mean time.

This thread is getting pretty heated.

You guys both have valid points, but can we try to keep it cleaner please?

I was thinking the same thing after skimming through the posts.

Please take note that only a fraction of PA players actually use this forum, so saying that most everyone posting in this topic disagrees with a optional feature means nothing compared to the entire community as a whole.

The argument that uber should not waste time/resources on a requested feature and work on what YOU think is more important is invalid IMO. I'm not saying you are the only one wanting that feature worked on, but some people are making it seem like if they work on this feature they will never get anything else done. I'm not a master coder or anything and only took a semester of CS before switching majors, but I don't think a unit cap will be a huge resource inhaling project.

Instead of looking only at all of the worst case scenarios, at least see out what can come out of having a unit cap.

Most RTS players will be coming from games with Unit Caps, so the transition from their previous game to PA can be a lot less bumpy with features that they are use to. After they get use to PA mechanics they can move on to what everyone else is doing, or not. It's their choice how they want to play a game they purchased.

So put your pitch forks down gentleman (and woman if there are any in this topic) and look at both sides before bashing the other.

you have the option to cut of your arm ... now you are carrying less weight but you also will have trouble holding that drill for your handymanns work ...

Bad analogy. You can't put a arm back on at your own convenience. You can however, turn the pop cap on or off as freely as you want.

sure you can put an arm back ... ... would be just damn fidly and require medics ...
that is however not the point ...
the point is putting a unitcap on will severly limit what you would be capable of ... as in you spammed a number of units realise they are ineffective and cant do anything else than to blow them up in order to be able to build new units ... or you realise you need more mexxes and factories and turrets but cant build them cause you are unitcapped ...

This game need a unit cap at the point where it becomes laggy and unplayable. It is way too easy for someone to build thousands of dox's in a game on a multiplanet system. It happens quite often and ruins the game for everybody.

It is better to have a unit cap then a game which lags and crashes. No matter how much you optimize the game it is going to get laggy and crash at some point.

Well then, perhaps an optional unit cap would be beneficial in more ways than one. For instance it would help with the strategy of the game and make people think about the units they should build. If you were to limit the amount of units you can build then you would not spam just any old unit. But of course it would still be up to the player to play how he or she liked to play.

I still struggle to comprehend why people are still against something that does not apply to them.

Ta spring has an adjustable unit cap (think max is like 10k per player so effectively unlimited given units are slower to build).

Most games play with 1k per player limit as it does help prevent slide show occurring.

What I've also had fun with is applying a very low unit cap on an unlimited income map (20 units)... It makes the game very tactical as you can make so little (a case of build factory, get units. Get rid of factory, get different fac and units) whilst not something I'd suggest all the time, the option is nice. Imo pa just needs a box where you type in a number (blank being unlimited).