Assassins are Anti-Fun. Regardless of their status as OP/UP

Go look at stats, see how many kills you've gotten, chances are you've killed assassins more than any other class.

The reason for this, is that there is so many BAD assassins out there.

By design however, Assassins are a class built around fun to play, not fun to play against.

Here are some of the things MOST players don't find fun (keep in mind this is not an absolute, but a generalization taken from years of playing with people, and reading design documents for games, as well as working on games of my own.)

Losing control of your character. Whether its air juggled in Soul Caliber, or being Stun locked in World of Warcraft, people don't like feeling like they are trapped. Watching yourself die with no course of action other than "don't let it happen in the first place" is frustrating to most players. Its one of the most important aspects to creating a sense of teamwork in the Left 4 Dead series, however its also one of the largest sources of rage quitting in the same game.

1 Hit kills. People don't like feeling like they weren't engaged in a fight in the first place. The assassin might have out smarted / out played you sure. That sniper might have fantastic aim and timing. But it doesn't make it any more fun to die from something you didn't know was coming in the first place.

Feeling like other people "have it easy" how often have you seen a mediocre assassin running around face grappling people unable to kill them and then smoke bomb - jump - lunge - cloak and escape with half their health. Nothing actually occurred there, noone died on either side, but an overextension/poor play such as that as performed by any other class would have caused them to die (thus learning a lesson.) All thats left is two players feeling they didn't kill the kill they deserved (assassin and her failed target.)

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I'm not suggesting any changes to any of the mechanics in this thread. I'm merely shedding light on why so many people hate the assassin, and to a lesser extent the sniper. And yet for the very reasons people hate them, so many bad players flock to play them to try and take advantage of these things without fully understanding how to play the game, or having any sort of skill whatsoever.

Speak for yourself, i enjoy killing many an assassin, either squashing them with my gunner or charging them with assault, if you rage from dying then crossfire might not be a suitable gametype for you, maybe try relaxing game of blitz.

Face grapple kills me 90% as a sin, smoke bomb comes often too late (maybe my ping or lag).

And sin is melee (shuriken are slow as fukk against moving pros), so for coming close to enemy pros, you should get something useful, a.e. instant grappel kill?

Heeheehee. Assassin squishy.

But seriously, the Assassin is similar to a certain French gentleman in one aspect - insanely easy to deal with once you have a little experience under your belt.

And if an Assassin hasn't been shot full of holes within two seconds of face-grappling you, your team sucks.

I don't have an issue with most Assassins, they get lucky once in a while when I didn't hear the cloak in time but it's a non-issue. You can fight back. If you die repeatedly to an average Assassin player you are doing something wrong.

Snipers on the other hand can cover large areas of a map and most of the classes have a snowballs chance in hell to do something about it. They have to hide and stay out of the LoS. I think that's a much larger problem in random matches since you can't rely on a teammate to kill the Sniper or at least keep him busy.

Once again, I'm not implying she is OP or UP.

You guys assume that I am, but I'm merely trying to describe what many many players have tried to articulate in varying degrees of success.

Also as for the comparison to the Spy:

Yes, she is similar in that regard. However just like the spy she has many "anti-fun" things. However unlike the Spy, she also has the "lose control of your character" aspect of anti-fun. While its done for the benefit of the person being stabbed (giving some time to POSSIBLY be saved.) it makes the deaths more frustrating when they happen.

Even with the fact TF2 has a much longer respawn time, which in effect makes the punishment worse when you die in that game. In monday night combat you actually have a chance of surviving, however that chance is based on factors outside of your control (other players actions.)

I'm not talking about preventative actions such as, learning to listen for assassins or looking for their cloak outline, or jumping a lot. I'm simply discussing the in the moment of the grapple.

And sensitive psycho, often times the assassn IS shot full of holes, thats why she gets away with around half her health since you receive I believe a 50-60% reduction to damage taken while grappling.

However you guys are returning to the idea of "balance" I'm pointing out aspects of the game that are by design irritants to most players. Not discussing how strong the classes are, or how to prevent these very problems. Merely pointing out what they are and that they do exist.

I see where you're coming from. However, it is a high-risk = high-reward system. The Assassin was able to sneak up behind you with her loud cloak and miniscule health, and therefore deserves to stab you in the back. Grappling is an ability available to all classes. Three classes throw you away when they're done grappling you. If you don't like that loss of control, then you should try to inflict the same thing back on the enemy.

It sounds like your argument is that Grappling is anti-fun, not Assassins. Losing control of your Pro isn't something caused solely by Assassins. Everyone can grapple.

Assaults and Tanks can charge you, you lose control when flying through the air like that (unless you have a jetpack). Ejectors and JB Slam do that too. Then there's Ice Traps, Product Ball, Scramblers, Smoke Bomb, and Shave Ice.

It seems to me that there's a lot of these mechanics in game that involve players losing some power of control.

Slam! Gunner's Slam is a one-hit-kill too.

I think the problem is not the kill, but the surprise that comes from it. Being killed but not expecting it is what isn't fun.

See, I often stir trouble with Snipers - I'm a tank, so with armour I can usually survive a few hits and deploy behind one of those glass handrails to heal. I'll do this many times over while snipers frantically jump up and down to reach over barriers to hit me.

If they get a headshot, lucky them. I'll respawn in eight seconds time and try again.

Why do I do this, you ask? I do this to distract them.

I do this so the Assassin on my team can sneak up and backgrapple them. In other words, it's teamwork, and I'm the bait. That sniper wasn't outplayed by a better Assassin, he was outplayed by a team.

If you find that anti-fun, then deathmatch mode might be more to your liking.

Snipers fit that description much more than assassins.

Assassins at least have to put their lives on the line to kill you. When snipers sit back in their base just picking people off, it feels like they're off in some other game that's only connected to MNC via your death.

I love me some pancaked Assassins brotha. Is cool brah!

Actually yes, grappling into itself is anti fun for the most part. The reason assassins come up is 2 things.

They have the most powerful grapple which is typically a 1 hit kill. See, all of the other classes which also have anti-fun mechanics have them on a more individual basis. For example, the sniper has a 1 hit kill, but it doesn't cause you to lose control of your character, and while you are locked in place by his ice traps you can still shoot (which gives the player a semblance of control.) Also while he DOES have a larger buffer zone for safety, he does get punished for leaving that safety and thus making bad plays.

Its true, every class has a "anti-fun" mechanic. However the Assassin has the largest amount, and the ones the combine together the most often.

Honestly I don't have trouble killing assassins (they make up more than double my kills for any other class.) and for the most part I don't mind losing, or dying. I'm a fairly calm gamer. However just because I don't rage out doesn't mean I can't see the inherent things that could bother people, or have some things bother me.

Could you honestly say you've never been disappointed or felt ANY sort of emotional response when some of these things happen? I doubt any of you could say its "fun" to get 1 hit killed, regardless of how many times you managed to kill that person before hand.

@bulletmagnet for instance would you say that that lucky headshot that forced you to work together as a team was fun? The working together was fun, but was the initial headshot something you felt was something you were engaged in and enjoyed the heat of that battle or was it something that just happened and now you are dead and need to plan revenge?

Anti-fun doesn't mean that other things in the game can't be fun, it simply means that a parrticular mechanic or aspect of something is designed in such a way that a person feels their choices or options were severely limited or out of their control.

Say you are playing this fantastic fighting game at the arcade, however this game is setup in such a way that there is a 1/5 chance that the person who challenges you will be invincible. The person who fights you may enjoy the fight, you might challenge em again because you know in a normal match you are a better player, however it doesn't make that one fight any more enjoyable for you.

For a regular kill? No, I try to look at what I did wrong, and plan how to avoid it next time (I really do).

If I'm on an epic killing spree, and just got my third Juice ready in the one life. Then, by George, I'll be off my seat screaming and crying profanities. But that's because I my spree ended, and it's not just because of Assassins. Gunners and Supports (**** you, Statement ;p) are the ones that get me the most.

If three Assassins surround me, and chain Grapples, then I'll giggle in quiet contentment that it took three Assassins to kill me.

What really gets an emotional response from me is pants-on-head retarded teammates. Supports who don't heal, or hack, despite my continued requests into chat/mic. Gunners and Tanks who stand in spawn room entrances.

I accept and agree that some of these things could, and are, annoying to some. But these things were put in the game intentionally, and aren't going to be removed. If these things annoy, then this game isn't for those people.

Oh for gods sakes can't we create an own forum section for whining? :cry:

l2read? He isn't whining, it's just an explaination of why some people whine, people need to stop seeing assassin in the title and answer thinking it's some random QQ.

Pancakes are definitely one of the most awesome things in this game, makes me maybe even more happy than bacon!

i think that all ppl playing assassins are huge pussys running around using cloak and that jump thingy all the time. hehe especialy if they don't do their job (and thats what most of the kids aint doing atm on pub) instead they go for pro hunting all the time. makes the game suck so hard think they are op :d but idk mby im the only one thinking like this.


in before all the assassin kids jumps right on me saying "MORE QQ" or some random ****. o/

sh*tters ""

I played assassin for the very first time today. i couldnt believe my eyes at the end of the round looking at my score.
I pulled off huge numbers with very little effort. And i will continue to abuse this class untill lunge+grapple gets nerfed.

pffffft noooooooooooooooooooooo

imo they should delete the class would make the game so much better and more skill based

It's not like that would change anything for you.

While this is true I think that's the point of any "assassin". Why pick a fight when you can end it in one move?

I can apply the same thing ("Didn't see that one comin'") to for example the ejector who kills me after I destroyed that turret or whatever. It's somewhat off a **** move but that's just how the game was designed and if I don't take advantage of it I'm a scrub.

Remember, Ejectors are easy to defeat.

All it takes is a single key press. Get yourself in the habit of looking at the Ejector buttons - red means go, green means jump like a rabbit.

Actually he is, moral of post is that the sin is having fun and the guy getting killed is not having fun, fair enough, but title of thread provocatively says "Assassins are Anti-Fun", only showing point of view of victim, to be neutral he should of said sin is fun and not fun.

I have no problem classifying this as a disguised whine thread tbh, interesting read though, but nothing new and mostly obvious stuff. Nobody likes to get killed, people enjoy killing yadayadayada.