The Drama-Free "Doxen are... almost... Completely Fine" Thread.

Scathis is one of the most intelligent people in the known universe. A study of Scathis' brain shows that it has many more numerous convolutions compared to the average brain. He will come up with a solution faster than we can think.


Above: A picture of Scathis' brain (right) shows far more greymatter than the average brain on the left.

*Sigh*

They don't have "Different" Options available to them, Vehicles have a consistent option while bots don't. That's just poor design and there are much more player friendly ways of creating True Diversity(a Single unit that does a lot of different things isn't the same as diversity!) while still giving both sides viable options.

Mike

Not exactly, boom bot has lower HP, much Higher alpha damage, lower DOT, less view range, and only one use per unit.

I dont know about where they dont fail to succsed, i mean rush game fast, aa ,underwater, mid, same, late sack 3 factorys for dont remember how much t2 facs cost to maintain, but lets say 26 bot facs for 3 t2 facs, you could do what ever you want ,take down alot of mass air stuff everywhere, too fast to be stoped and if you sack something for that much advces i cant see how they could fail, i mean invade planets, fast polite, patrole, take down tonns of eco, i would rather have 26 facs makeing only dox then have better units. I dont think they were ever made for anything else then killing buildings and air. If you are trying to kill of armys and other ynits beside fabbers you gona have a really bad day. Good example, get a teleporten on another controlled planet, have the teleporter patrol planet stream 26 facs of dox makeing into em= very bad day for the other loser.

Vehicles have the consistent option? Consistent because the game thus-far has only had AA Missiles and Flak hit Air?

The Dox has a diverse set of uses and abilities. Provided it isn't good at AA then it won't replace Vehicle AA. Separating abilities and attributes arbitrarily in the name of diversity is illogical. Why would there be a pot-shot AA bot designed soley for taking inaccurate pot-shots? It wouldn't be worth it.

This makes me want to play PA so badly.

This isn't about Bots VS Vehicles, it's about both being viable in isolation. The problem is that now Bots have this Dominate unit now not just because it's OP but simply because it is the most versatile unit available to them(followed by the Slammer, the Dox's Advanced counterpart).

I get that people love the idea of a unit being able to shoot at land and air, but it's not something you can just slap on to any old unit, especially when you have it use the same weapon for both because it a balance nightmare.

It's depressing to see a game that was supposed to favor unit diversity shove 3-4 unit roles on the Dox, 2 on the Slammer and 1.5 on the Gil-E instead of creating new units.

Mike

Guys, you are playing it stright to the devil. They did this so you dont think they will be geting shields, everything makes sense now, cracked! The puzzel is cracked, shields guys, shields.

wat

just saying but the "dox" that you proposed would not be able to tank the damage from tanks to get close... but the problem is that Unfernos would already do that job, but w/ better odds...(sorry but the last time I read until the damage and range part)
the bomber bots should get more HP, not kill each other when die, and when die explode like the commander

You'd be surprised, the actually work very well in my balance mod. They are fast enough to get close, and they deal enough damage to take out ants without too many issues. The only problem they have is with infernoes.

but infernos don't do that allready?

I see where you're coming from.

As I've said, I don't think Dox/Slammers should have torpedoes capable of hitting surface structures/ships.
As for them attacking Air I can see how it might create balance issues. TA partly addressed this with faster moving Air units. Sight/Attack range and cost will probably be tweaked too.

The Dox may be versatile, but so long as it's relatively ineffective at these various abilities, we still have room for niche units. Therefore I'm comfortable with it having multiple abilities, provided it is designed around the principle that a generalist is never an expert at anything.

Infernoes aren't fast, light-armored, cheap, and low-ish damage...

There is a difference between a generalist design and a unit with lots of roles shoved onto it. Them problem with making a "generalist the way the Dox is currently is that it's really hard to adjust because multiple elements depend on the same factors. Like I said about the Anti-Air element, because it uses the same weapon it's much more difficult to have it work as intended for both Land and Air simultaneously. It's the same with it's amphibious ability, how are you supposed to balance it's extra capability to go through water when it does so just as fast as it would be on land? You need to design with both pros and cons, right now the Dox doesn't have much in terms of cons directly related to all the Pros it received.

Mike

I agree. Things like reducing speed and sight range whilst underwater and ensuring their AA fire is less accurate than their land fire would be steps towards balancing the buffs and new abilities the Dox has received.

Except you can't do things like that in PA yet so it makes Uber's decision to try and balance Dox like this even more awkward and even then, it's not just about applying Cons that only apply in specific scenarios. Your suggestions are solutions, they're workarounds.

Mike

Changes I would support to the Dox to help balancing them in the future:

No air shooting.
Cost -> 50

No amphibious.

They are balanced otherwise. Mixed army > Dox only. Get rekt.

Amphibious might be okay, but not in its current state. TA style amphibious (under-water, slow, no shooting, sitting ducks) would probably work. Think I'd rather have specialist units for that though.

Anti-air ability doesn't make much sense unless you open up for other non-AA specialist units doing the same. And that's a can of worms if there ever was one.