Assymetry in Galactic War causes big problems in its current state

Discussion in 'Balance Discussions' started by TheBigBadPanda, July 12, 2014.

  1. TheBigBadPanda

    TheBigBadPanda New Member

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    I just lost a Galactic War on my second battle in a very, very unfair way. The bot i was playing had access to T2 air, T2 bots, T2 economy, as well as lots of orbital tech (lasers, radar, solar cells, etc). The system had 2 bodies, the starting planet and a small moon.

    Despite the tech disparity, i won the battle on the spawning planet. That didnt matter though, because my opponent had gotten a small foothold on the moon and was using this economy to build orbital lasers. This would be fine in a normal game, a mistake on my part, but since this was GW i could not do a single thing about it. It wasnt that i had skimped on building avengers, it was that i didnt have the option in the first place.

    The only orbital unit i could build was the lander, and the only thing i had that fired on orbital units was the Ion cannon. This meant that as soon as the bot started building orbital lasers, i was logically eliminated from the game. A really simple equation really: the bot had offensive units that i could only defeat with stationary defenses = he had free reign to do whatever he pleased, which was to kill my commander without me being able to do a single thing about it. I have had similar experiences a few times in the past, and its getting frustrating.

    I was playing on "relentless" difficulty, and i suspect that this might have something to do with it. It still does not make it acceptable. Flat out having unfair advantages in amount of tech is a very arbitrary.

    TLDR: There are situations in GW in the current version where the tech disparity creates extremely unfair scenarios. This should be a high priority issue for the devs, especially since GW is where new players are likely to "test their wings" . Asymetry should be used as a design tool to create interesting and varied challenges, and thats not what it is currently accomplishing.


    EDIT:

    Expanding on this issue. In the games current state pure dumb luck has heavy influence on the early stages of GW. I have started a few GWs during the afternoon and have had highly variable starting positions. In one i spawned with only one possible route, leading straight into an enemy system (leading to a similar situation as my first post). In the most recent one, i could explore 9(!) uncontested systems, and by the luck of random tech distribution i now have vehicle engine tech, advanced engine tech, complete orbital tech, advanced air tech and artillery tech, and i havent fought a single battle yet! If this is intentional design, i would really like to hear the thought process behind it.
    Last edited: July 12, 2014
  2. trialq

    trialq Post Master General

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    There are scenarios that are tricky (not impossible afaik) to overcome, but laser snipes is not one of them. A single umbrella would negate the laser snipe. By tricky, I mean things that are a PITA and not fun to deal with, like:
    • Having to build hundreds of astraeus as a beachhead to maybe get a teleporter up to invade another planet
    • Water planets, with a large body of water that an enemy can hide in, with no naval or air or t2 bot or artillery tech

    Tips for an easier life in GW:
    • Always go orbital at your earliest convenience, not only is it a safe haven if the enemy is likely to stomp you on the main planet, it stops the entrenchment
    • There can only be water on earth and tropical biomes, avoid these biomes as much as possible if you do not have the right tech

    Galactic war tech acquirement is dumb luck, as implemented it's not great imo. I'd like these changes:
    • No or very few free planets to get free tech at the start
    • Always at least two options for attacking at the start
    • You know ahead of time what the tech you'll get for beating a planet is, or at least the broad category they fall under
    Then there's some proper strategy to it.

    • I like lists
    gtf50 likes this.
  3. gtf50

    gtf50 Member

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    Galactic war is similar to a very simple roguelike, so the randomness is both expected and intentionally designed. Naturally, its probably going to undergo some major-ish changes, so the current difficulties players face with invading planets may or may not remain. What isn't intentionally designed, I believe, is having not a single empty system to explore. From my experience in generating GW maps, you generally have 4-6 free techs on the default size.

    I like that you don't have basic necessary techs in galactic war to some degree: it helped me learn the game. However, knowing the full game better, it does seem massively restrictive and repetitive compared to multiplayer matches against the AI.

    Those are some nice lists ideas trialq. Having a rough idea of what you could attain from battles against the AI could dramatically shorten the tech grind once you have found the faction leaders, as well as reward attacking certain out-of-the-way planets.
  4. maskedcrash

    maskedcrash Active Member

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    In addition to what's been said above, sub commanders are a cool idea, but ludicrously overpowered. Turning most fights into a 2v1 is bad enough, but you can potentially have a 5v1. Also, they make Stronghold missions impossible by turtling up on a main planet, endlessly spawning units. And while I have a pc on the higher end, it can eventually crash the game. Also, ever tried to fight an army of t2 vehicles (read: Vanguards) with only t2 bots and t1 vehicles? Not fun.
  5. mjshorty

    mjshorty Well-Known Member

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    i always try to fight on single planets first until i get orbital tech
  6. gtf50

    gtf50 Member

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    Yeah, sub-commanders make non-boss fights truly boring. 5-10 minute ordeals, but really boring.

    Ah, but slammers kite vanguards so easily, especially if you get a bot combat card. Galactic war is the one place where I can actually slaughter vanguards with bots. So refreshingly different. So satisfying.
    Last edited: July 13, 2014
  7. metagen

    metagen Member

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    To be honest, I would like to see a "currency" system and tech tree instead of the current system, so I could unlock what I want to unlock when I want to unlock it, with a dash of randomness thrown in.

    Here is how I envision it:
    • You start off with basic T1 and T1.5 unlocks:
      • Mexes and power (obviously)
      • A factory based on your chosen commander
        • T1 fabricators
          • T1.5 defenses
          • Radar
      • Orbital launcher and teleporter
      • Anti-nuke defense
    • With each planet you conquer, you gain X units of currency; each unit of currency can be used to unlock a unit or structure (or group of units or structures) within a given tech tree. For example, let's say I start off with a vehicle commander:
      • I have access to:
        • Vehicles
        • Economics
        • Intelligence
        • Base Defenses
        • Orbital
      • With currency, I can unlock access to:
        • T2 vehicle factories; this includes:
          • Advanced Fabbers
          • Levelers
        • Specific T2 vehicles (Shellers, Vanguards etc.)
        • Advanced Mexes
        • Advanced Power Generators
        • Avengers
        • Anchors
        • Orbital Factories
        • Etc.
    • When you defeat enemy faction leaders, you gain access to a randomly determined tech tree.
    • When you defeat enemy commanders, you have a chance of getting a randomly determined enhancement for existing units or structures, or an additional loadout slots for more enhancements
    Discuss?
  8. pieman2906

    pieman2906 Well-Known Member

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    It's a roguelike system, dealing with the randomness is meant to be part of the challenge.

    Also, as of yet, outside of boss battles, i've never had difficulty just rushing the commander. They can't tech up if you hit their expansions early and keep a throttle on them, I've done this with vehicle commander, bot commander, even freakin orbital commander. You just can't let them expand or get the eco to tech up in the first place, which is fairly simple to do.

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