There's A Cash Shop In The Game?

PA is Uber's product and they have the right to monetize it how ever they see fit. It's a delicate balance to walk between sales and public opinion. Uber would do well not to piss off their fans, but in the long term if whatever they do results in a higher profit, or even allows for more resources to be put towards the game, the argument can quite easily be made that it was worth it. I expect that they didn't make the decision on a whim. They probably expected backlash, and probably even at least some people to leave because of it. But it's their risk to take.

I agree. But it's not just that commanders' costs that need to be covered. I don't know how much business theory you've had a chance to explore, but the key concept here is that of contribution. Uber has to make enough each month to cover their fixed costs, or they go under. These include staff salaries, the building they work in, running servers etc.

It's easy to turn a profit per unit on a commander, but it's a whole lot harder to keep a business afloat on it.

Man, if only the pricing was more approachable so more people could take part!

To me this just feels like yet enough "Good enough" solution to add on to the list for me.

Mike

Then don't buy a Uber priced Cosmetic upgrade (mouhaha, happy with this one...) but one new game key and give it to a friend.
More altruistic, more money to Uber, and you makes me happy.
What else do you need for having a good day ?

If sales of commanders slacken, they will likely lower the price. It is as simple as that.

If it is too rich for your blood (as it is for mine), don't buy them.

Community consultation on pricing would be by its very nature uninformed and biased, making it a waste of everyone's time.


It honestly makes no sense to me to complain about commander pricing. though we're probably going to have this same discussion with any of Uber's continuous money making ventures such as the mod marketplace.

And making the assertion that voting with your wallet doesn't work just because the vote hasn't worked out in your favor yet doesn't mean it doesn't work. That is like saying democracy doesn't work after an election where party A got elected but you voted for party B.

Your analogy breaks down because unlike a vote where everyone is counted regardless of opinion, the people who don't buy aren't being counted here. For all we know Uber should be lowering the price because a majority of the people who would purchase aren't because of the prices.

Mike

it is not a vote between those who buy and those who don't.

by that logic, the price of almost everything should be in constant, rapid free fall. After all, those who don't buy a specific product is almost always going to VASTLY exceed those who do.

It is a vote to change the price. If you purchase it, it is a vote to remain the same (or go up I suppose if enough buy, but I see that as unlikely here), if you don't, it is a vote to lower it. And just like a government, change happens slowly.

Where the analogy breaks down is the precise 50% line you find in governments, but not in pricing. Different circumstances have different desirable proportions.

Besides, I haven't seen any cited evidence supporting poor sales of commanders to begin with, it looks to just be assumed (although I think it is a logical assumption).

The point I'm trying to make is that we have neither the right, ability to make these decisions, nor the information to make an even vague attempt at making a reasonable one.

its just a slimy way to make money. Yeah people don't like could just buzz off and buy anything, but still it just makes a game look more likes its only in it for the money.

They have a pretty unique problem here. They do continuous work on the game just like an mmo but they only take money from us once. It's not a sustainable model and this is one way they can extend the development period.

Hey man, with all respect I kinda have to disagree here. At the moment it might seem as though there's only a handful of commanders available but more will come...part of the money will go to the backers who those commanders actually belong to.

Where is the line drawn as to what we should get as free? Making stuff costs money... I backed $150 on kickstarter for PA and while I don't agree with the current pricing of the skins I do think they should be allowed to charge for them. I'm not entitled to any of those skins for free nor should I ever be. It was never included at my backer level. If Uber want to give me free skins then awesome, that's super rad but not charging for these particular backer skins when others have spent $1000 to get a unique commander and then I get it for free. Man that's not cool and what does that say about us as a community?

Cheers,

-Todd

What some people see: Sleezy game just selling a cheap product for as much money as possible

What other see: a game being made without a production company so every single dollar is salvaged to help development

What is actually happening: It is just a business, every dollar extends the game and company, the company needs money to exist, companies without money don't make very good product nor do they develop very fast. Most vaporware and insanely slow development are non profit companies, and there are a LOT of games I like made by non profit entities. I am waiting for a 3d engine remake of Star Control, an unreal remake of C&C Renegade, a stealth attack and defend game called Project Stealth, and many other games made by people with time consuming day jobs and family lives.

Thats really the bottom line. Planetary Annihilation has a staff behind it. Their company payroll commits dedicated people daily work on PA. The work done is pretty nice, its still so early development just because it is a brand new built engine, but it is some amazing programming work. The more they offer in the line of anything anyone willing can buy, the more dollars go in the jar to fund their work another day. The longer they can work, the more code they can add to the game.

*shrug* they don't "ruin" the game either way. Some people cite Planetside2 and SOE as example for people struggling for money adding game mechanics ruining their game to encourage sales. This is as far opposite with cosmetic commander sales. Pay to pretty, help show dev support. *shrug* I don't see the problem.

No it isn't. It would be if you had to buy them, or if they actually did something special but they don't. Just skins.

while I would like to have all the commanders. The price point is still too high for me. I will wait til it comes down to a level I can swallow and then buy the crap out of the commanders.

Why?
Because some of those designs are just freakin' cool and I want them and I want this game to succeed.

I am 100% behind Ubers decision to make additional moneys by selling special commanders. I will be up in arms if they start selling metagame bonuses like production efficiency etc. But I will say that I am confident that is not going to happen. In order for a company to pull some crap like that they would have had to be under a rock for the past 10 years and completely ignored all of the pay-to-win hate that is out there.

What I think would be totally awesome though would be them taking a user developed model from something like IMVU. You open things up to user created skins and models that can track derivative ownership and provide all of the design tools in a nice little bundle. I am still making IMVU money on t-shirts I reskinned 5 years ago.

I would also love to see a mod market place that allows us to make a little bit of money off modding the game with pier review.

Yeah that was my first thought to, because normaly a cashshop and microtransactions imply firstly pay to win and secondly that the developers are greedy little b******.
But in this case there is nothing sinister about it. They want to support the game after release and they need a financial basis for that. And most importantly, the stuff they sell is purely cosmetic with no effect on gameplay.

I disagree.
Guild Wars is a MMO (well, almost), and you only needed to buy the game to play. No Monthly fee.
This was a freaking BIG deal for ArenaNet who made HUGE load of money with the game (and the 4 expansion packs).
Still less than Blizzard, true, but it shows that this economical model works.

That's not a very good comparison.

Uber doesn't have nearly as much to fall back on if the money stops flowing in.
MMO's have the option of releasing a new expansion and BAM! Servers stay running and employees keep their salaries.
Uber not so much, from what we understand there's no real plan for DLC, everything that's updated into the game will remain free.
Areanet had the safety of releasing a $30 expansion, everyone who already payed for G.W. was pretty much guaranteed to buy it. But Uber can't exactly sell their game to people a second time.

A microtransaction store really is their safest bet.
Either that or selling DLC, which like I said, there hasn't been an overt statement on any plans for it in the future.

selling something that you don't need to buy to play the game and doesn't give an advantage in any way is "a slimy way to make money". got it.

Do programmers work for free?

Aye, but Guild Wars was a multiplayer arena combat game with heavy RPG almost MMO elements. Sadly it is a genera that has typically a larger user base than us poor PC RTS players. True the RTS genera player base has remained stable, if not grown in the last ten years but we simply do not have the numbers that Action RPG games have. Strategy games in general typically cost more to develop and so come out less often as a result.

Now of course in saying that, I do wish to add that the Strategy game has many sub genres. 4x turn based grand strategy(Civ, Galactic Civ, Might & Magic). Real Time Strategy (Planetary Annihilation, Command and Conquer, Sins of a Solar Empire) and don't get mad for me including these, Casual Strategy(Tower Defence, Collectible Card Games, and web based empire builders). And sorry to say us RTS players don't really have that big a wedge of that market share.

If it were not for the kickstarter I doubt that a game like this would even have been made. Too big a gamble for a publisher, admittedly publishers in general tend to be reluctant to aim for the niche markets. And even though this game is not "released" seeing as the last sale went as low as $15. Realistically aside form a group of people waiting for that green light of v1.0 everyone who would buy the game has most likely done so already. That means new income for Uber has slowed. And the team developing the game, balancing, optimizing and a bit of new content is still needing to collect salary.

Now that brings this post around to the the cash shop. These commander skins are rewards for those who backed at at least the thousand dollar mark. Originally they were to be given the skin and just five codes for their friends. Meaning for all that work only six people would even get to see the end product. This armory is mealy allowing more people to gain access to content that normally would not have been available. If memory serves the idea for selling these skins did not come about till work for them even began. It was not their grand design to bait and switch a pay to win model in the ninth inning. It was pointed out by the community that they could do this and it simply made since form a business stand point to do so and not violate there ethics.

Truly I don't believe Uber planed form the beginning for this to even be a thing and I do not see it as a sign that they are in great need of funding. What they would make form this is mealy a windfall but they are looking at this as viable way to increase money coming in.

And I remember them talking about how from this they intend to make a custom commander designer at some point. allowing you to make your own custom skins, for free. Please remember that just because that has not come in yet does not mean anything. Hell the first month of alpha there was not even navy or orbital. Give them some time.

It seems kind of lame to have an arguement about Ubers selling cosmetic items in game based on their "attitude" toward the community. So far I have seen:

• The games early access delivered as promised.
• Features promised in the kickstarter developed and released (Planet strikes, Galactic War, Linux and Mac versions)
• Active participation in bug fixes responding to bug reports in forums in in the tracker, while the game is a moving development target (no easy feat)
• Active forum participation
• Organizing and promoting community events
• Making the game extremely moddable from the beginning (this is of HUGE value to every one)
• Providing opportunities to buy the game at very reduced prices (coinciding with an Uber staffer trying to get as many people as possible to get excited about the game as possible on that sale day)

In light of these and well probably many more I dont know of, I really see this as a non-issue.