Assist/build order merge

So there are two different orders, or atleast used to be
1) build order
2) assist order

I've noticed that using the build order on an unfinished green building causes the fabber/commander to behave as if an assist order was given. That is, i want the unit to build the structure and then move on with the rest of it's build queue. Instead, it is sticking around and assisting the factory even though i gave it no such order to do so. Very annoying and tedious micro to babysit disobedient units.

I would have posted this in the support forum as a bug, but i have the suspicion that this was done on purpose because someone short sightedly said "hey i want them to assist the factory after they build it", without thinking about what that actually meant.

Could we please get these two orders back as distinct behaviours next build?

If we really want to get rid of tedious micro and irrelevant orders, I would suggest other things like making continuous build mode default by option.

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I don't even...

*Mod edited - watch the condescending attitudes, please*

Can you please stop spamming the thread up with your stupid memes that arn't even relevant to the topic. You clearly don't understand the problem here.

Simply put, if you can't comprehend the issue here, your control in rts games is quite poor (an objective observation). Please, try not to be ignorant and assume all is fine just because your low control level playstyle doesn't experience these problems.

Quite often players will want to add extra fabbers to a build queue train, re-queue etc. When you do this, headaches ensue. The way it is currently has no flexibility.

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I also find this annoying. And tatsjub here's what I do:

1. Select fabber and use shift to queue up a factory and some other stuff
2. Select another batch of fabbers and order them to assist in construction of the first factory
3. Use shift to add a different batch of orders to the batch of fabbers.
4. The fabbers will never do orders.

This mostly happens when your initial fabber has been destroyed and you order another batch of fabbers to finish the factory and requeue the order. it is VERY annoying and unintuitive. If I wanted them to assist the factory I would have specifically told them to do so.

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Yes I order up and assist constructing the factory, not assist the factory in constructing units. If I wanted to do that I would have used the patrol order or I would have specifically stated it to assist the factory. The point is that usually you don't want units, you want a factory, because assisting in unit production is inefficient. That is why it is unitnuitive. If assisting a factory would actually be a thing you do always then this system would make sense, but currently it doesn't and should be removed/reverted back.

How does lack of editable build queues justify the current implementation? You're just throwing smoke bombs now. Please, i'm honestly trying to find something in your post that I can reply to and constructively add to the thread. Throw me a bone.

Flow economy and simulated projectile real time strategy games... I..

It's like you see it, but choose not to?

Ok ok, lets try this way. The game should be designed to provide value to it's playerbase right? So unless you have something else totally irrelevant to say, i'd like to hear why you find the current merged assist/build orders convincingly better than separate assist/build orders, as in previous builds. Otherwise, why do you care so much either way? Why are you trying to impede positive progress?

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Right now, you don't need to assist buildings in construction to get the fabber to assist, because the build order is automatically turned into an assist order. That's the problem.

I think it's apparent now that you don't understand what's really going on here. You've misunderstood something somewhere, and i'm not too bothered to figure it out for you.

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Hey, if you want a batch of fabbers to assist the construction of a building, but not assist it afterwards, why don't you give assist order to the original builder, and not the upcoming building ?
For me the outcome is pretty obvious :

1. Fabbers assist the original builder, once done they all carry on with the building queue.
   
2. Fabbers assist the building construction, once they are done, the builder carry on with the building queue and the fabbers assist the factory.

You may tell me, you want (previous implementation no more available):

• Fabbers assist the building construction, once they are done, the builder carry on with the building queue and the fabbers are idle doing nothing.

This should ideally never happen
(1) seems the most appropriate.

EDIT : Ninja-ed

EDIT 2 : And if you want the following :

• Fabbers assist the building construction, once they are done, the builder carry on with its building queue and the fabbers are going on with their own building / orders queue.

Repair command should work on the constructed building.

If I order them to assist the initial fabber they will continue assisting the initial fabber and STILL not move on with the order I have given them. In the event that the initial fabber is gone there is now easy way to order them to finish what he was building and mode on.

The even where my fabbers that I have ordered to assist are idle after assisting is less than 10 % If I select a batch of fabbers, 9 times out of 10 I will give them more than one order and 1 times out of 10 I will only give them 1 order because I don't want them straining my economy and I want them idle doing nothing. This will realisticly always happen if you are smart enough to build backup fabbers, because you always want to have a group of fabbers ready to do what you need at that moment. be it assist a factory, reclaim, build defenses or simply replace lost fabbers elsewhere.

Also:

• Fabbers assist the building construction, once they are done, the builder carry on with its building queue and the fabbers are going on with their own building / orders queue.

This is exactly what I want and this is how it was before the current build. Like I said before I'm rdering an assist with factory construction, not an assist on unit construction, because long term assisting of factories is a bad idea, because it's severely inefficient. Ideally you want more factories rather than mass assistance of one.

Sigh... come on...

right click on a contructing building and tell me what icon it shows. Is it an assist icon? Or a build icon?

Now, use the build order hotkey and click on the building. Tell me whether it just builds, or builds and then assists.

See, this is the kind of short sighted thinking that i think went into uber's decision to change to this current system.

What if I only have one fabber and want to requeue? What do i assist? What if i had to move the fabber away to avoid some enemy unit, and then requeue after the enemy unit is gone?

And why do i have to assist the fabber that is building as a work around? What if i don't want to assist the fabber but want to branch off to another build queue? What if i don't want to assist the fabber because it wastes build time when moving from building item to building item?

The thing you people don't seem to get (and will never get it seems) is that there is much less flexibility now.

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Are you seriously kidding me? wow, just wow.

That is a blueprint, not a building under construction. With someone so skilled at flow economics and realistic projectile simulated strategy games, I would have thought you'd known better.

Why don't you let it build and then mouse over it?

God forbid it come up with this

instead of this

You really have no idea what we are talking about, right? We are talking about assisting a factory that is already in progress of constructing, not queueing up a new factory.

Also @elodea is currently second on the ladder.

Please tell me more about how terrible it all is!