will the Unit Cannon be added in Gamma?

I can tell you now that we won't be able to shake a concrete 'yes/no' out of them as to what will and won't be in release, but we are due a meeting with Uber soon (this week perhaps?) and this thread will certainly be one of the topics brought up.

One of the bigger issues about not having the Unit Cannon I forsee is actually in terms of "Logistics" rather than what was "Promised"(Bolded quotes for emphasis), but still thats kinda an issue, I mean, they've been saying that the Unit Cannon has been "Low Priority" and "Hard to Code" for months now, maybe they've known all along it wouldn't make release? They do have a precedence on this type of thing, same thing happened with the idea of working with modders pre-release, but that wasn't going to happen and we only found out about it by coincidence.

ANYWAYS, Logistics.

What I foresee is that they're putting in all this effort into designing the game around NOT having the unit cannon, doing 'odd' things to make teleporters work, interplanetary nucks and other things "needed" to make the game work on an interplanetary scale and while it's not quite as fundamentally as changing the way the Commanders works or how the economy works it's still pretty significant in the end. Jump forward 6 months* after release and what happens? Issues.

The most worry-some is that the Unit Cannon will then be beaten on until it's unrecognizable in order to fit into the "Teleporter/Nuck" based Meta and not do much to actually change up how the game is played because that's the easiest path, after all so much time and effort was already put into balancing the game around the Teleporter and Interplanetary nucks, even if it was just a "stop-gap" solution at the time. fun right?

The other thing that could happen that is arguably flat out better is that the entire game is re balanced and the "Meta" shifted completely to support a "proper" use of the Unit Cannon not unlike what was initially talked about/what we wanted in the first place. The catch is that while it sounds great on paper the process is much more complex, with many more ways it could go off track or run into difficulties. Will the game have done well enough to be able to pay for all that work, will there be people available to take on that kind of project? Will users be alright with such a big shake up? Lots of questions with no easy answers.

All in all this whole situation is quite troubling.

Mike

Actually, I could only imagine that the Unit Cannon would basically balance itself.

It is basically Nucks attack design, with teleporter results.

How is that not balanceable. It has to be placemented, like nukes, and it makes units appears there, like teleporter. If you ever wanted to destroy the enemy, but also establish a presence, consider the unit cannon. If you just want to vacate their property, best go with nukes or kew. If you want to establish a distant presence with no resistance, best go with teleporter.

Unit cannon and other ways of delivering units like large one-use (they won't take off on its own right after drop) space drop ships and naval LCU's are very important for late game, ground forces should be major offensive force, and stuff like interplanetary nukes would make situation even worse.
We don't need more super-weapons, but more ways of transporting units in heat of battle - teleporter is great for moving large volumes of units but it's often useless for assault purposes.

Unit cannon would be great if it would be able to be used on full gravity planets like long range artillery piece to throw units into center of enemy base (over walls and defenses) and spread carnage everywhere !

It is not worry that I feel (after all it's just a video game).

It is disappointment. I really, really liked the Unit Cannon and all the promises about Water Worlds and Subs. Uber needs to get this things straight and clearly tell the backers that plans changed.

Let's see what you guys will end up implementing for invasions across planets. Perhaps you're right and it will be epic. I sincerely wish it will.

They've communicated this in two live streams and multiple times on the forum.

I think the only real question left then is Gamma the last phase before release? If no, then count me as patiently waiting for Delta... and if it is? Well... prepare your metecritic account lol.

To Rho and beyond!!

I'm really sad to hear that the unit canon (and subs) won't be in and I must say I agree with some of people that have posted in this topic that stuff that was showed/promised in the kickstarter should make it's way into the game before release, even it it's the last thing to do before releasing, because as it stands the games is not exactly what people expected it to be. It's like getting an audi A8 instead of audi S8. It's basically the same game, but some of the things people were most excited about is missing. It's not game breaking and it probably won't make the game feel like it's missing something essential, but it will make the game feel different from what people were expecting: when going naval, you either go ships or air. There is no third choice, like there is in ground (thus making naval feel as a second class citizen after all). And without unit cannon a very important unit that played a keen role in marketing will be missing.

On the other hand if that's really the final verdict for subs and unit cannon then something must be changed to accommodate for the fact that they are missing. In naval warfare there really is nothing add. We need subs for that second factory unless we can expect boats, but I highly doubt that. I guess naval will have to stay with one exclusive factory only and with very monotone ship on ship combat (well it can be epic too, but even the most epic things become boring if they are the only thing to do over and over and over again). As with orbital invasion. currently the only way to assault an enemy planet when you don't want to lose yours and it's heavily fortified is spamm nukes and outnuke their antinukes. Astraeus aren't really viable because they are produced so slowly and are so fragile that oyu are likely not going to be able to land. They need an HP boost and a cost decrease or and increase in unit capacity to be viable tools for invasion (Also the exploit/bug where they can drop off cargo before landing needs to be fixed).

Stretch goal that people paid money for, so it became a feature that has to be included in the release upon being reached.

To not do so would be to effectively state that you lied to secure more funding.. imagine if no stretch goals were implemented because it 'took too much manpower or effort'. The money was given to make those goals a reality, so if it hasn't been spent to make sure they occur, the backers have been misled. Its really that simple.

If subs dont work, they shouldnt be pulled. Instead that money allocated to the stretch goal should be turned into man hours to make sure they are implemented in a way that both works technically and for gameplay purposes.

Sorry if this post sounds entitled, but in the age of crowdfunding, its pretty important that this is pointed out over and over again.

With all this said, I do believe we will get the unit cannon, our subs, and gas giants in due time, and that people are panicking a bit much.

Were subs in the original stretch goals? I thought it was just a generic "naval" goal.
And yes, I would have to agree that if it was promised, it should be delivered. However I don't recall Uber saying gas giants and unit cannons won't be in, they just won't be in YET.

All you need is patience, my friends

From the original kickstarter text:
"Some of the water units we can expect include subs, amphibious units, floating buildings and of course battleships!"

I guess we won't be seeing amphibious units anytime soon either.

So what?

It does not change the fact that they removed a big part of the original concept proposed on Kickstarter and some of the main selling points. Go back reviewing the trailer if you doubt about, or reading the Kickstarter page.

In fact they also declassed the naval aspect of the game from "first-class-support-for" to "nice-to-have" and heavily dramatically reduced the relative unit roaster and complexity of the overall game-play.

GoodOak said it all: https://forums.uberent.com/threads/will-the-unit-cannon-be-added-in-gamma.57450/page-3#post-892411

I sincerely find in these aspects very valid reasons to be disappointed.

However, as I said many times, I still think that Planetary Annihilation is an already damn good game on a single planet. And I am looking forward to see how Uber will solve this impasse on multiple planets.

I wish them to find the most brilliant solution, and I trust that they're able to do it.

So I wait

So unit cannons currently aren't currently on the cards.

So how can we shore up current invasion methods?

Personally:

• Change the default system to include movable planets, and possibly a more diverse set of planets and moons.
• Keep working on the halleys and small asteroids to refine their gameplay, and make it easier to control, and use.
• Figure out and implement asteroid belts (Personally hoping for a roid spawning system, where used roids are replaced, but have no metal, only weaponisable)

This way we can move into what Ubers original goal for the end game was. The total destruction of the systems metal deposits, burning the planets into molten wastelands aster consecutive bombardments.

This would be awesome. However this can only be part of the solution. Planet smashing does not make a beachhead and is no invasion option. It would be a great step however to make small asteroids which cause less damage (lower radius) than smashing entire planets.

Very true, it doesn't help you invade.

But that is also kinda the point, you don't invade, you just BURN EVERY WORLD TILL YOUR ENEMY IS DEAD!

But yeah, its not a conventional way of invading, as it does destroy metal spots in the process.

If the devs have put unit cannons on the backburner, its probably because they think that the difficulty of implementation is not worth the gameplay they provide.

So instead of just fussing, lets try to provide a convincing list of awesome things that ONLY unit cannons can do, and let that list convince uber instead.

So, Ill start. Lets say that dropping a teleporter from orbit is an effective invasion method, because that seems to be a thing now. (I think this is pretty cool, honestly.)

What can a unit cannon do that this cant? This is probably better at simply transporting units in volume. What about raiding a reinforced planet? Now, this is something I can see unit cannons doing that a tele drop cant. I can scatter raiding parties all over a planet, providing something between "Ignore" and "Full on Invasion".

Indeed, the Unit Cannon appears more and more like a big obstacle and an embarrassing topic for Uber.

My guessing is that rendering a massive amount of units moving from a planet to an other is not a viable option for the core of the game.

Therefore, the impossibility to implement the Unit Cannon. The Devs just can't make it happen. The Game Core simply isn't that capable.

Understandable. It may very well be a hell of a math.

So, what about a good old Dropship? That way a set of units can simply drop by from the Orbital layer, and only temporarily pass through the air layer, before landing on the ground.

Where everything is proved to work quite nicely already.

Actually, we could even fake it, and let the Unit *magically* appear into the Air Layer directly.

It's like you don't even read your own posts.

I'd be content to see any way of invading without a teleporter. Astraeuses are simply too slow to build to be a viable option now.