What feels just right in the balance now?

I noticed that the description for this sub is:

But a quick view of the front page reveals almost 100% negative 'this bit of balance sucks' threads. It's important to let the dev's know what isn't working, but to also let them know what we like. So why not have a positive thread to point out balance changes that seem to hit or be close to a sweet spot. Obviously if you feel the answer is "nothing at all" this may not be the right thread for you. Let's try to let everyone say what feels really tight for them in this last patch, with out piling on too much flamery.

For me, I really love the rebalancing of the bots. In the old build bots were just too weak and vaporized almost instantly. Now they feel like an excellent front line unit that can be quickly produced in mass and sent in ahead of your tanks to soften up defences and harass. They are light, fast, and easy to manoeuvre meaning you can often get them around walls right up close to knock out a key defensive point in a suicide attack. If they punch through then it's easy sailing for your tanks to get in, and if not then you know to turn back. T2 bots also feel great now, with the sniper bots forming an excellent backbone to a T1 army, knocking out defense from afar and helping support a retreat. It feels great to retreat from an outmatched battle and watch your snipers cover the flanks, evening up the confrontation. Same goes for T1 combat fabs, who when sprinkled within a blob can really improve the punch of your army. In all I think the current bot balancing is getting really close, encouraging a mixed-unit force of bots tailored to whatever situation you need them in. It feels right now like bots serve a very dynamic purpose, forming your front lines, whereas tanks are the slow heavy hitters that need air and ground support, but ultimately finish the job once on point.

I'll also add that I love how easily T2 bombers shred through a unit column, really gives you some oh **** moments and makes you keep a balanced mixed unit force.

Here is a few of mine

I feel T2 Siege Bots are currently too strong in comparison to their supposedly more devastating and heavily armoured Vehicle counterparts.

T1 Interceptors are in a good spot for mobbing T1 Bomber Screens, but fall flat against T2 Bombers. This promotes T2 Interceptor building, which is good.

Since the arc change on both forms of static artillery, they have become very... selective in whether they fire or not, I don't like this as it means your defence can be utterly undermined by what is essentially, a LoS bug.

Catapults are still ridiculous we need some form of point defence that doesn't fire fast enough to utterly counter them, but give players enough time to find and get rid of them before they lose their entire base/commander to tact spam.

No comment on naval, I've only used it once in about 40-50 games and I found the pathing alot to be desired.

Unit cannon cannot come soon enough for siegeing planets. Although the 10 Orbital Fabs > TP invasion is now a good way to get a foothold.

T2 bombers are still in a very... odd place, as evidenced by the numerous threads pertaining to AA and Bombers.



Aaaand that's about it. If anything else comes to mind I'll edit it in.

I like the impact of T2 bombers, their destructive potential is lovely on my bots.

Artillery is OMGWTFBBQ nice, and the effect is awesome.

I am really liking the walls, although stacking with repairing is a concern.

Land bot gameplay is really fun, the snipers are a very nice addition to the rapid assault style and really help make up for the relative bot weakness to static defences.

I like the Leveller nerf for fire power, and could only suggest a slight change to make their guns do a better burst, but with a slower fire rate, as they currently sit as nice addition for a T1 tank army.

Playing defensively is really fun against enemy mobile artillery now, as counter battery fire is a proper concern do the the slower nature of defensive static artillery, while still retaining their own power.

Loving the range of artillery too, even on a size 2 planet maintaining proper control with artillery is much more challenging then in the past.

Hey well at least you put a few positives in among all those negatives But I agree T1 fighters are in a great place and there is a very natural transition to T2 fighters, which I didn't even use before.

Yeah I actually love the new walls, I think some are a bit iffy on them, but I don't use them to turtle at all, just to funnel units at forward proxy bases. I really like the idea that they are more for maneuvering enemy units than defending structures and they seem to be doing this well. For anyone to use them at all they need to be cheap, fast, and sturdy which they are right now. As long as there are units at each tier that can either move fast enough to get around them or fire over them they don't seem to promote turtling too much - an it's still really clear that aggressive expansion dominates turtling (as it should IMO).

Actually, I really do like turting with them, and building fortresses should be not discouraged.

But what we really do need is good siege units and artillery, so that an expansive player has their options to directly combat a defensive player without having to resort to game enders to beat them.

As was the problem with previous games....that and overwhelmingly effective defensive artillery.

Gunships are neat! I look forward to art upgrades on them.

Walls and defenses feel pretty good right now.

Tanks would be great with a touch more movespeed, if only while not shooting.

I like the idea of a very slight speed boost when not firing, makes them a bit more dynamic on large maps while still ensuring they form the rear of your attack column. I haven't played with Gunships much yet, have you found them to be useful as is?

Very good question.

Deserves a very good answer.

Don't think the answer exists.

Then a quest is at hand. To the land of the gods!

I can definitely attest to the heated arguments with Bombers and AA. there's an intricate balance tha has not quite been achieved.

however, i will applaud the changes to artillery. they feel like proper mortars now, and not the AoE snipers that they once were. i actually have started mixing in T2 Arty tanks in my hordes, because in a firefight they act as a force multiplier, able to weed out the weak while my main-liners duke it out. Pelters function much more like mortars now. and they actually have decent accuracy, making them a solid addition to defenses, without becoming the main line gun themselves.

cheap walls are good. i can rip out an emergency barricade quickly, and pair them with the cheap turrets for a quick "panic defense" for low cost.

i've yet to fully utilize minefields, but i get the feeling they will become a quick way to stealthily deny ground movement against an unwarry foe, perhaps even being used like a trap:

-make an intentional opening in your defenses

-lay down mines. lots of them.

-watch the enemy tank horde drop like flies while the other guy scratches his head.

-laugh at his foolishness.

-????????

-profit.

I haven't played with mines yet much, but agree that the artillery nerf was a good choice. Pelter creep made for horrible gameplay and was really annoying, now you see a lot more units on the field and fixed point defenses, making for more variable gameplay. I still think the firing arc is a bit wonky and could be tweaked a tad, but it's nearing a sweet spot. I like the new walls a lot, just like you said they make great battlefront encampments.

Good siege units work both ways. They can make an impenetrable fortress just as easily as they can push against one. That's why the idea of a stationary midrange artillery is so flaky.

Moar Balance!

For mobile arty.

Edit: T2 Sniper bots are gods against static defenses. Too good even. They are now my favorite unit.

Nothing. Balance hasn't happened yet.

Balance is ongoing, hence the point of this subforum... the header of the forum says "discuss what feels good and what doesn't in the current balance." But I guess you don't really care to contribute either way.

Well the thread title is 'what feels just right in the balance just now?'

I don't think anything feels 'just right' in the balance at the moment. If you don't want honest answers then phrase your thread title differently.

Fireflies are perfect.

I like the new botfactory looking way different then the vehicle. I like the visual effects. I like some of the area commands. I like the pace of the game. I like winning. I like losing. I like the differences between the fabber and the combat fabber. I like the raptor commander. I like the teleporters. I like the deepspace radar. I like the missle turret. I like the way you can manouvre bots trough craters and dodge shots. I like the kick and password functions. I also like that it keeps improving on the things i don't like. (Targetting unitfire on enemy's on a very small planet should be a high priority atm plix por pavor, a lot of combat units are totally ineffective).