Should metal extractors consume energy :

I just exposed that that isn't the case currently in PA, can you explain why?

THIS

I don't want a miniscule cost which means nothing. There are reasons for metal extractors to either drain or not drain metal. I think that most overall game mechanics/designs can be implemented without 'resorting' to metal extractors which drain energy. If an element does not need to be added it may as well not be added.

I think the people here need to:

1. Stop trying to make realism guide the exact details of the mechanics. I think the theme/realism should guide the overall gameplay, this decides the mechanics and the details can then be justified in the lore. The lore should not control minute balance details.
   
2. Either reconcile the two ideas "Energy stalls should punish the player" and "We should avoid tedious micromanagement" or state that you do not agree with at least one of them.

no this isn't a talk about realism.

I said in the OP "Strategic Depth" dictate either it's usefulness or it's unusefulness.

to put you on the right tracks:

I think it's a good idea that a energy cost be put to operate mass as it would punish a guy who's angle at the game is to take countless mass points, stack up on mass he doesn't use and wastes massively and only later on in the game builds the energy to correctly exploit all this mass.

if the game is correctly balanced you should be able to surf* both resources at all times (enabling at the same time a pro-level prowess to aspire to) (with of course a more or less impossible to surf energy in the late stages of the game).

*to surf : keeping the resource level under 100% and over 0%. Ideally the lowest possible, while still being a safe zone giving you time to react in case of sudden change. for example: 10% of mass is a good amount to attempt to 'surf' on.

Well if extractors end up having a power drain of one power plant, why don't you just put that into the extractors cost and cut the drain?

That is also the current problem to me, your power drains and your economy crashes, when really it should still be working up to the power income of your power plants then to have your metal economy also crash and further escalate the problem.

Also, did we all have a huge thread on this a while ago?

EDIT: https://forums.uberent.com/threads/planetary-annihilations-economy-system.44173/page-37

One quick search and there we go!

drain is continuous, given infinite game time the implication is that : Drain always bigger than up-front cost.

Yeah, but building is only the energy cost to run the builders.

And even then, why would you not have field generators build into the extractors?

because realism (or lore) isn't the argument here, see above.

I don't find it a fun game mechanic that because one side of my economy runs dry, it should also screw the other side.

That is my argument, game mechanics.

I don't find it a fun game mechanic that stalling energy be 'OK-not so bad' ever.

A stall to me is trying to spend more then you make, so your spending slows down to what you make.

AND GOD F***ING DAMN I HATE YOU BLOODY SIGNATURE, I WISH I COULD HIDE THE FREAKING THING.

So I don't under stand why it would be a good idea to allow your power economy such overriding control over your metal economy when you are spending more power then you make.

It seems like it would highly punish the times you do spend more to the point of stopping your economy entirely.

Logistical management is nice, but I don't like having to fight my economy as well, that to me is a very bad mechanic is a RTS game.

Energy stalling already puts you at a huge disadvantage because it runs your radar and fabbers (and will eventually be needed for certain weapons). If you don't have enough energy to power your fabbers then this lowers your build power until you can rebuild the p-gens. This already reduces the amount of metal you can spend. Why does the player need to be hit with a double whammy, losing their metal income AND their ability to spend it? Losing p-gens already cripples your economy, why should it be even worse?

P-gens are already a priority target, this would only solidify their place there. This is why people are saying that mexes consuming energy adds no strategic depth. The effect of this change is already in place, you are only compounding an effect that already exists because of other mechanics.

I changed it back happy?

now ponder my arguments with serious thought :

If you are allowed to build metal extractors without cost you can build them left right and center. and rookies coming to the game will make the mistake of wasting metal.
whereas my solution makes the game teach them that both resources (while useful for different things) can not be be dissociated and must be treated with equal care.

Also energy is easy (since wasting it is ok) mass is tricky (since wasting it is not).

Ecstatically!

How are you wasting metal by building metal extractors?

Aren't you supposed to building them everywhere?

And ain't you supposed to building a powerful energy economy anyway?

I don't understand, this is a land grab game, why would you not want more?

having the bar at 100% is called 'wasting'. It's lingo from TA, Zero-K, supcom and Supcomfa. See my post about surfing (in the post you just replied to).

What does wasting metal have to do with mexes using power to run?

uhm...

So if mexes used energy to run, suddenly people would learn not to waste metal anymore? Could you explain in detail how that works exactly?

I now don't understand at all.

Are we talking about a stall, or not spending your money?

wow I'm really going to have to spoon-feed this to you aren't I?

well, Yes,

considering the current scale, say you're on a 1200 size planet, that's 285 mass points. mass point galore right?

given an opponent on another planet or even say "sandbox mode" you can take all 285 of those mass points without a single power gen or factory or engie. ...and have both resources positive.

with an energy drain. you'd be at 1% production speed on @SatanPetitCul UI economy mod after the 8th mex or something.

teaching you that for any amount of mass, you need an equivalent amount of energy.

WHICH IS TRUE in current PA gameplay with units engies and factories. (and an opponent)

and you'll continue to learn all the facets of this lesson as you learn and progress in the game and you refine your different artisan's tools such as 'micro', you'll also refine your 'economy' tool.