The Politics Thread (PLAY NICELY!)

Sort of the inverted thing what happened in christian countries. They were full of religious **** while the Islamic regions invented all those great things.
Lucky us the Enlightenment (or Aufklärung or whatever the best english word is for it, talking of the historic thing, not the process of sending a scouting plane to spy on your enemy...) came along and step by step religious ferry tales were replaced by rock solid science.

Some Islamic countries sure could use that kind of thing and I am sure it will happen. Most likely it will happen earlier the less war is brought to those countries. Yes USA, I am looking at you.

Assuming the topic of the discussion he uses those arguments in is about stuff that matters for work then you have every right to do so.
If you interview a person for a programming job and he declares he won't use math because his whatever religion says that is the work of the devil the person simply does not have the qualifications needed.
But if the only issue is the question "who created the world and when" then that really doesn't matter at all for the job of programming some business software, so should have little to no meaning for the decision of hiring or not.

i feel like some people in here would like to watch this

Yes a lot of bad things happened in the past and Obama certainly did not deserve a noble price of peace.
He was a let down in many ways for sure.
So what? Just because bad things have been done in the past does not make them right now.

That video is incredibly biased and aggressive. Not gonna help.
It's following a strategy of making joke of any opposing views using cherry picked examples

A strategy of pointing at the wrong doing of others to justify own wrong doing.

A strategy of putting everyone who disagrees into a group of "left whatever I forgot his words by now" and discrediting that whole group, as to teach people to do the same. Teaching to check for any signs somebody might be part of the undesired group and then just going "yeah that person is **** anyway, cause he is part of that group".
That is the same mechanic that makes genocide possible. Putting people into groups and than dehumanize one group. Then tell your group to kill the other. Not saying he is calling for any violent actions, but he is pushing people one step down that road. No good reason to every go down that road.

A strategy of straw men arguments to discredit that group of "the others".

The tone used is one that basically demands "I am in the right and you are WRONG" it demands absolution. No gray. Only black and white.

The tone used to read out arguments of opponents "the other group" in turn is specifically made to sound ridiculous and stupid.

It's a well made video to influence certain groups of people into going deeper into the rabbit hole that is splitting the US apart. That guy sure passed his course in "how to propaganda".

Don't they teach you in school to know a propaganda guy when you see one?

Also yes "muslim ban" might be an oversimplification. But saying "<list of countries here> ban" with the full list is way too long to write each time.
It is bad to discriminate people based on their country of origin and no other considerations whatsoever.

E pluribus unum (out of many, one) use to be the US motto on our great seal. It is funny that people interpreted that to mean many people, races, religions, languages, and ancestries become one people.

Maybe, Americans are less hypocritical today though. They are being honest,"we don't want your damn refugees" could be the new motto next to our new great seal a giant wall.

My big issue with the video was using one unrelated tweet to link to another and call them both hypocrites without evidence provided to the viewer that it was true.

I agree with the premise that people are overreacting to the temporary ban. I disagree with the ban on the basis that it wasn't passed through congress since there's no evidence of need for an emergency order. Then again, I have similar issues with every president overstepping their authority. If there were problems with the current vetting process, I would understand a temporary pause to improve them. I don't think we currently have such an issue, and I'd like to see evidence on this case.

And for the Trump assassination quip... I spent 8 years listening to bullshit conservatives talking about how great it would be if somebody shot Obama and how he deserves it. Now I get to hear 4 years of bullshit liberals doing it. Great. Thank you for reminding me.

I'm not going to fault the video for being inflammatory, because it's probably primary intended as entertainment.

Theoretically, the ban is in place so that they have time to implement a system where they can learn more about them than just the country of origin.

If you believe this, then why not stand for the establishment of such progress in nations that currently repress science or civil rights, in favor of killing in the name of sky-daddy?

I don't think we need to cut refugees btw. We do need to be damned careful of them though, they just happen to have the ability to drive through dense crowds of people, killing about hundreds at a time.

What we need to do, is firmly encourage hostile nations to develop. They are doing more for their religion by being kind to their fellow man, sinner or not, than they are by killing them. Nobody ever went to heaven by coercion into religious practice, they either practiced with their soul or it was fake, whether Christian or Muslim. Neither should prosecute sinners of any kind, that doesn't save sinners, it damns the attacker and harms his institution as soldiers in defense of the attacks can come and end that religion with superior firepower if antagonized.

They just need to develop, and learn to practice in an outreaching way to attract volunteers and not conscripts, to keep their enemies to a minimum and stop jeopardizing their own domestic tranquility and chance of military conflict.

It's sad though. Conservatives hate islam and love christianity and run the law enforcing such, and Liberals hate christianity and love islam and run the law enforcing such. Neither, at the electing level, try to grant unharmful liberties to both, while limiting harmful actions by both. They are both source of terrorism, lest we forget Colorado Clinic Shooting.

By the way, a pittance on fake real news, or is it erm... real fake news? Idfk. The way CNN can sometimes take a Colorado Clinic Shooting, and say it was "a robbery leading into a clinic" when it was a "psycho christian shooting baby-killers". Or, report a "white male shooting up an Ohio Campus", while recent-dumbarse George Takei rants about gun control, just to later find out a somali refugee stabbed a bunch of people on campus. Just stop already, everyone complaining about fake news when "real" news is often laughable.

Lastly, for the record, politics are still stupid, way more than you can actually account for with any logic or direct idealism. Obama essentially created the muslim ban, and you can't make this **** up if you tried, I'm a fanfiction writer, believe me.

You probably are aware that's kinda ... a little bit more extreme than reality actually is?

It's a stupid ban, that much is certain.

The first point, is not how 80% of voters under a party feel. It's how the party governs, in extremes. It's a electoral war, and when one side wins, they punish the other side with a total swathe of policies across the board that are based on "let's stick it to them real good".

The second point, is that the Clinton Foundation's biggest donors were Saudi. ******* politicians won't touch them because they are so influential, in the way liberals make believe Russia to be. They blatantly give them allowances on everything Iran is condemned for. Democrats won't prosecute Saudi, Republican won't prosecute Saudi. Saudi, is "rich", Syria, is "poor".

At the end of the day, it's just another class thing. Nothing is ever religion, or race, or gender, it's always eventually "class". Rich influential LGBT supporters**, belittle toothless ignorant rednecks. Rich influential conservatives, belittle unemployed ethnic youth rioters. A rich nation, prosecutes excessively the poor, while the rich get 3 months in prison for blatant public rape. A rich nation, bans immigration from poor nations, while a rich nation highly similar in violence, gets a pass.

The closest thing to getting away from this **** in America, is Libertarians. We don't need strong government initiatives, if they're nothing but negative influences and practices. We could strip the whole damn thing and be better off, than we are if we give douche-A or douche-B the chance to take the wheel and emote their anus all over their perceived enemy i.e. what is likely 40% of the nation's population.

**Since Tatsu is english-as-second-language, to clarify, I'm specifically talking about those elitist 1% that claim representation on social media in the name of their entire group, but then can't be bothered to be constructive about it. The other 99%, are silent and might as well not exist, because their voice belongs to someone taking it on a frivolous joyride. My friends aren't all exactly normal, but none of them support that garbage just because they are "similar" to the person speaking.

this poor get stuffed while rich get unfair ease argument suits poorly a guy who supports the man who only gets in with the richest crowd. plus i think you're confusing the middle class and the really rich. the really rich have thousands of corporations in their name. they are also very few : they have very little voting power. they do however have very successful ads and campaigns amongst the poor.

another thing how the hell is LGBT a "rich" thing?

so much hate flowing right out your mouth I can't even.

They, as a whole, aren't. The spokespeople, just like the "spokesperson for conservatives" being Trump, well... they have been known to be inflammatory and belittling in exactly the way I constructively describe. Instead of "namecalling", can you support how they aren't doing it?

By the way, you get the "you're" right, but miss the capitalization? Might as well follow through by being a grammar nazi, goodness knows it'd happen to me were it you.

I literally cannot believe. A moderator. Edited an image from my post. That was an emoji created by an LGBT liberal activist / celebrity. I literally cannot make this **** up, and I'm a fanfic writer! If that isn't @wpmarshall 's personal verdict that liberals are closet-bigot hateful aggressive hostile garbage, I don't know what is. You saw it here, folks, HalfLife3 confirmed.

Look who loves the idea of the ban.

If anything is propaganda, that is propaganda :thinking:

Is the logic "ISIS is happy that the US screws over Muslims, because ISIS needs Muslims that hate the US" really THAT hard to understand?

Exactly the same logic used by the author to make up that article.

That article is just one out of many. The actual one I originally read was this one .
That one also explains how the IS propaganda has been hoping for stuff like this since years.

The Spiegel is not in the business of making up stories.

Are you trying to troll me?
The jihad propaganda is going on about a holy war against the evil western powers.
For that to work they need western powers that look evil.
You can't have a war without a believable enemy.
Can you understand that?

Although you might really not understand, if all people would understand this then there never would've been any sort of jihad in the first place, this mistake has been made since forever.

What do you think terror attacks in western nations actually are trying to do?
What motivation do the attackers have? What motivation do the planners in the background have?

I kinda wonder what people who do not agree with the idea "violence vs terrorists makes more terrorists" answer to these questions.

In a way the US is getting gamed hard by them since at least 2001.

They read 3 telegrams and a tweet and claim to know exactly what isis, al-Qaeda and other jihadi groups think. I smell lie...

Now those terrorist can say "US is really evil, they have approved a temporary suspension for immigration from 7 muslim countries. Bombing us wasn't nice, but preventing our muslim brothers from going to their unholy depraved shithole country is going way too far".

Don't you understand some people are just bad, and if they have the means they will rob, conquer or destroy others to make money? Yeah don't blame jihadists for the jihad. Man, for this kind of guys the Buddhas of Bamiyan were a believable enemy.

Then why do terror attacks in the US. Why in Germany. Why in France. What is the point of that? What gain do they get from that?

By your logic those attacks make no sense. Killing random people like that gains no money at all. All it does is seed hatred. Why do they do that?

Only few people are bad without a reason. Just going "they're bad because they are bad" is on the level of the church of the middle ages going "humans are the center of creation, because the bible said so". I though you didn't like that way of baseless thinking.

The travel ban affects 200 million people (my memory at least remembers that number, somebody please do the math if you want a more accurate number). 200 million people who will probably feel discriminated against and rightly so. Also many refugees who are in dire need of help. Instead they're told in the face "You may be dangerous to me, don't get close, I don't care about you".

The German article states many examples of messages from jihad supports that fit in pretty well. They also reference the official ISIS propaganda magazine "Dabiq", apparently an issue from 2015.
It also references US security and foreign politics experts on the topic, for example Robert Richer, who previously worked for the middle east Division of the CIA.

Going "lies" that easily is pretty weak of you. Can't you at least try to actually show more arguments than "people are just evil" and "they are lying, I just know it"
?