The Ethics Of Mods In Competitive Play

That's not subjective. You can get the same functionality from ubers hotkey system that you can from Hotbuild. It's just a different way to do it. It is absolutely fair in that regard, though I do recommend Hotbuild to everyone I can due to its ease of use.
Trying to argue it gives an advantage because of one extra button press is semantics. Just stop. The stupid makes my brain hurt.

In addition, UberMap gives an inherent advantage because of the functionality it provides. Just because (for example) killerkiwi cannot utilize that functionality correctly doesn't mean the argument is invalidated. I don't use UberMap because I think it will make me lazy and slow with map awareness. I would rely on it too much.

I'm arguing against mods with a clear and quantifiable advantage over vanilla. UberMap possesses said advantage. Hotbuild doesn't.

While you are of course free to reply, my question was specifically directed at elodea.

And I replied to your incredibly shortsighted question for him. Good God.

why would you say that then follow up with a sentence that's ALSO subjective?

you're giving me more work than I can chew.

hotbuild2 existed at a time where no uber implementation did. was it the same then?

it also existed at a time where uber's impl sucked. was it the same then?

it also exists now and you know what? it still isn't the same. as far as I'm aware walling a PD or any other form of template is not something uber's impl can do.

Yes, how shortsighted of me to ask a person to back up their position with specific examples. No one should have to do that.

Who said it was the same? I said it provided the same functionality: a customizable hotkey system. Sure its better polished. That's why I recommend it. I know people who dislike using hotkeys entirely and they do just fine.

Except we are all quite knowledgeable in these matters. It takes two seconds to look through the thread and pamm to find the mods we are referencing. Why even ask?

I don't think we even need to look at advanced hacks like that hotbuild has. It's enough to look at the main system: Cycling hotkeys. PA vanilla does not have those. They are clearly better than non cycling ones in terms of speed. Can easily be considered an unfair advantage. If somebody says "UberMap is unfair, hotbuild is not" it is a clear subjective statement. Hotbuild adds new features just like UberMap does and based on how addicted I am myself to Hotbuild I'd say that it is a huge advantage compared to vanilla. You can't disprove that without going subjective.

no it doesn't. clearly scripting walling a pd has nothing to do with rebinding keys on the keyboard.

I dunno where this argument is going but once again it seems it all comes down to misunderstanding how code works.

Well, why don't you enlighten us then?

No-one I know of who uses hotbuild 2 uses this functionality. With the exception of colin.

I don't even know if it's still in there or works.

That was removed a while ago. It was also banned from tourneys, if I remember correctly.

Hotbuild doesn't add any new functionality to the games ui like UberMap does. It's a hotkey system. Quit arguing semantics. How hard is this? Just accept the fact that UberMap gives a player a clear advantage and should be restricted from tourney play.

this is where it gets ridiculous. You guys are so hotheaded with that word. ban! ban! ban!

ban what?

placing walls around the pd?

he's not arguing semantics if you'd listen he said you can hit the same key twice or more to obtain several different results. a feature base impl does not support.

and one that is vastly superior and provides an 'unfair' advantage at a exponential scale.

Automatic Walling is still in and has not ever been banned, don't make stuff up.
Also cycling hotkeys ARE a feature. No matter how you look at it. And the reason why you "would suggest hotbuild" is precisely because it is a superior feature. I could just as well claim that UberMap is just a better PIP. Same concept: Helps to get an overview.....

Banning the specific functionality of auto placing 360 degree walls by Hotbuild. How much clearer do I have to be? It's really obvious when it happens haha.

well

1. apparently you made that ban up
2. that's what I'm sad to witness.... you really think you wouldn't get tons of false positives with that? Am I to take it if you were king of the world you would "ban" all those who oppose you as well ?

hitler did that.

It's a completely different functionality from the PiP. The PiP lets you keep tabs on other planets or the opposite side of the planet or nukes or whatever. The UberMap gives you an overlay of every planet in the system at all times, and it adds vision retention for enemy units. Hotbuild without imba walls doesn't do that.

Are you nuts? Have you watched that thing place walls? It's REALLY OBVIOUS. Just watching it place walls that fast makes it super obvious.

so now we gotta segment mods... this is getting convoluted....

apparently it's also really obvious when someone is a clandestine immigrant.

that doesn't mean we expatriate all of them on that eye observation.