Please DLC!

Just listing all the units possible doesn't make them useful.

Which is why you got the rocket truck spam, along with the rocket tower spam.

All of those units are useful.

Seriously, go play BA and then come back and talk about how it's all rocket truck spam.

Because it isn't.

Well, im not going to, because that's besides the point.

BA was balanced after the fact, TA, in order to make all those units useful, rather then creating a new balance and actually requiring those units in the first place.

BA might be balanced,but it wasn't designed, not by them anyhow, it was designed by Cavedog.

And as supcom shows, you don't need an extra 6 versions of the same unit hamfisted into the unit list, you only need 1 or 2 that actually can do more then one task without failing completely.

And supcoms unit list is much, much larger then most RTS games unit lists, let alone the redundant mess of TA.

BA probs has at least 50% more units than TA and many units were more or less redesigned by the creators to be completely different (EG The Viper). BA was, more or less, designed by its creators.

I'll agree to disagree.

I think Stuart is correct that ba is an excellent example of how a large unit set can work, although in fairness ba has been evolving for over a decade to get to where it is... The number of silly balance patches in the past (luke the t1 scout > all)... It wasn't always perfect!

I do agree though, pa would benefit from a few more units imo, though I'd like to maintain the clean focus uber have shown. My suggestion is to add hovercraft to pa... And make them available both on land and in the sea as currently naval players can't attack land very effectively. It would also allow tanks vs ships battles which are always fun

you may praise the ballances of mods ... but the thing is they are JUST mods ... we want ballance for the vanillagame ... as such we are comparing vanilla with vanilla ... as such both TA and SupCom were less ballanced than PA is

Lol balanced annihilation isnt a balance mod for ta, but a complete ta based game for the spring rts engine, and is, in my opinion at least, the best way to play ta these days as it retains all the good whilst fixing the problems.

I agree vanilla pa is better than vanilla ta... I'm not so sure about sup com though (supcom 1 wasn't very well balanced I agree, but supcom fa was imo).

Point is all we are saying is there is room in the pa unit roster for a few well thought out units without damaging the balance at all, and said new units would energise the multi player community again I think.

no one disagrees that PA could/should have more units in general ... so that isn't even a discussion ...

don't want to come of as a know it all or anything ..
but BA is not realy TA then isn't it ? fact is it is not made by the original developers ... and if its on spring then its not even the same engine ... meaning i am not playing TA at all but a springgame/mod, no? ...

point is you can't tell someone to go play spring when he talks about the original TA for a comparison ... the former doesn't make the latter better ..

same with command and conquer and openRA

I don't agree that ships can't attack land. They obliterate land because all land is completely flat.

What I would like to see though is aircraft carriers to allow you to stage distant campaigns (or more to the point, prevent you from staging distant air campaigns without some form of carrier support).

The units in PA don't really interact with each other, no mobile shields or jammers, the best you've got is sticking vanguards at the front of your army.

What I mean by 'cannot attack land' is that all you can do is hit stuff which is in range of your ships. Even with the leviathan that isn't actually that far inland. Ok on a small map ships can dominate, but take a big map like Amplus, or even Meso, there large areas on both maps that are totally protected from sea leaving your only current options to attack them as air / orbital or build a base on land (which is invariably in range of Holkens if they've started to porc up).

Having hovercraft that can be built by factories in the sea allows a sea based player to build a decent *land based* invasion force to send in, and co-ordinate with air strikes. That strikes me as much more interesting than the current position which is *win sea, now turn off all those naval factories and do something else*...

The purpose of Hovercraft and Amphibious Factories is two-fold.

Firstly, they allow a land player to attack a naval player (Especially hovercraft, as amphibs tend to use torpedos underwater that means they have a hard time getting into the water without dieing) and allowing a naval player to attack stuff that is out of range of their ships without having to go mass air or hoping to get enough shore-side factories to match that of the land player.

combatfabbers repearing units, aa guarding units against aircraft, vanguards and walls taking damage for units behind them ... stealth ain´t much of a big deal ( isn´t realy interacting with units but with the enemies vision) ... and we talked about shields to death

also extremly usefull for when able to use both transports and teleporters to invade difficult terrain maps (say lava- and ozeanmaps) ... (another reason why i would like naval teleporters)

I'm not overly convinced about hovercraft. Your argument is what, you could build the factories in the sea rather than on land where they may be vulnerable, and visa versa? Seems a bit weak to me. It would be cooler if you had ship transports so you could build a load of land units on a different bit of land and then charge ashore with them with your ships. It would make gameplay a bit more tactical than it currently is, which is simply... amas a load of units, march them into the enemy base.

Hover tanks absolutely owned in SupCom2. I'm not dead set against introducing them in PA but I don't really see what it solves.

Yes the shields conversation was done to death, as was I'm sure radar jammers, but it would be nice if the game moved towards forcing you to logistically plan your attack a bit more and introduced some variety on the tactical side.

SupCom2 was pretty much spot on for this, you could kill your enemy in any number of different and interesting ways and you could solidly react to any play you discovered your enemy was making. With PA you don't have as many viable options, you don't have as many chances to surprise your opponent, and the game is on the whole a bit stale.

it simply adds flexibility on the surface ... what it can solve is ground and naval being to divided
lets say a player has naval control while the other has groundcontrol with both having good aa (and for the heck of it) good ao .. so yea hovercraft would be another option ...

i disagree ... considering PA has multiplanetplanetplay and the orbital layer as well as global maps there are many ways to catch a player offguard .. what it is lacking are stealthunits and multiunittransports for quick strikes ..
other than that i find PA´s possibilities more than equal to SupCom 2 ... heck SupCom 2 even had less basic units per faction than any RTS i know and merely compensated with lowlevel experimentals ...

also difference between stealth and shields for PA is many rather want the former than the latter ... especialy if it were to be included as it were in supcom

Only with teleporters.