I'm no longer playing 1v1 after these games.

Lobby ID: 2775971278773788386 (Copy number, CTRL+V into search bar) tanks vs utter bot spam...

Spoiler: Outcome

I FAIL HARD

Lobby ID: 4199640210615974157 (Copy number, CTRL+V into search bar) utter bot spam vs utter bot spam...

Spoiler: Outcome

I FAIL

This new meta will work every single time on these planets and there is nothing you can do to counter it. Really, try it. You're not going to lose on planets without water if you copy what this guy does.

For the love of god, remove Dox AA. I'm seriously not going to put up with this.

jk

Bombers actually are better than I thought. At first I thought huge dox blobs would shoot down huge bomber clouds. But actually the bombers are able to let off their payload, and only a few bombers die. A group of 200+ dox can die with only 6 bombers in a line. That's pretty cost effective imo

A new convert! Come play the CUBM

8 factory botspam would beat it 50% of the time i think

That's even worse probably.

In previous patches, bombers could easily destroy large swarms of dox. In the current patch, bombers can easily destroy large swarms of dox.

Lobbies used to be the only thing on my major-bug list, but not after today.

I'll try a build mixed with half dox and half air then report back

so just to be a critic, you should have scouted noticed he had no air, and never made the spinners or fighters.... because you wasted a good chunk of metal on that. also get infernos mixxed in a bit to take away dox ability to charge into tanks

And then add spinners to counter their air when they make fighters to kill your bombers. And build tanks too because once you start bombing their dox, they will spread out and be harder to kill from the air but much weaker against tanks.

I'm sure there is still balance that needs to change, but I feel like this patch is a step in the right direction. There is room for cheese builds and people can always catch even good players by surprise, but I think once we all learn how to play again we will find that there is more than just one unit getting used.

In this patch bombers are *considerably* better against large blobs of dox That's thanks to the fact that Bombers have been modified to *explicitly* not remember target priorities unlike other units.

All you have to do now is fly them over some units and they drop bombs, simples

First and fastest thing i learnt was that 1 fabber bot factory spam is the quickest way to lose a game now, especially because of the lower acceleration. Bombers will bomb all your mex, all your dox, all your fabber gg. And especially on Styx, 1 fabber dox spam will land you a big fat loss when people do more standard stuff like orbital plays.

Game 1 (#2775971278773788386):

• You didn't get a skitter to scout early in order to see what he was doing. Neither did you scout straight away with your planes. Once you did scout however and saw he was going bot factory spam, you didnt stop producing spinners or hummingbirds.
• Your first bomber was idle for a long time after scouting and did not try to attack his fabber expanding at the back or the dox swarm attacking you.
• You saw his bot swarm on radar for a long time but did not position your tanks properly to deal with it
• Don't build metal storage so early - also an idle fabber later.
• You should not have pulled your tanks on the right flank back to defend because they would never reach there in time to do anything. They are already so far out you should move them to attack the opponents metal to take the edge off reinforcements or trade metal spots.
• Didn't build walls to protect your double laser turret
• Bombers idle alot again. You never rescout to see if he is going air or not. And you never try to bomb his fabbers while he has no aa whatsoever
• You tried to expand with unprotected fabbers, which is not smart against someone with dox when you are playing tanks.
• You continued building factories with commander when you would be at something like -100 metal on 100 metal income (200%), instead of pushing forward to build metal, walls, and turrets. And when you did decide to push, it was already too late.
• You continued to try and react to dox attacks by moving your tanks from one side to the other, which never works because of how much slower tanks are. Always have your tanks in positions to defend, and counter-attack from the other side when the enemy commits everything to one side.
• You didn't zone off the back of your base with either turrets or tanks to prevent dox runbys.
• When you attacked his commander, you did not manually target him with your tanks to allow them to shoot over the wall. Nor the laser turrets, which again allows you to shoot over the walls
• Did not have your commander in front to uber cannon the dox when they counter attack. Instead bunched up all your tanks around your commander, making them easy targets for uber cannon, and also making them unable to present full length broadsides.
• You then got target fixated and attacked into the wall instead of trying to go around while defending that portion with your own walls and turrets.
• Didn't recap safe metal behind your base or build turrets to protect that side when you committed everything to the other side.

General Feedback:
Throughout game 1, i saw nothing that said you lost because dox shoot air. Infact I saw the opposite, with large numbers of dox being massacred by your bombers when they wern't idle. Why you lost this game has got to do with your tank positioning, no reaction to enemy strategy, constant idle bombers, and lack of turrets and fabber protection.

Game 2 (#4199640210615974157):

• Didn't scout with atleast 1 dox to see what he was doing and if he had any weak points
• If you are going to do 1 fabber build, you must attack attack attack instead of idle in base untill you have a large army. This is because by right you will have bigger army than someone who does more than 1 fabber, and same ammount against someone who does only 1 like you. Attacking is a no loss situation. Only when you do more than 1 fabber would you want to play defensive like that.
• Went 3 bot factories before air factory, which is basically asking to die against anyone who decides to go air as their first or second factory. This should be a very real possibility in your mind that you need to prepare for unless you scout otherwise.
• You didn't scout with your fighter straight away to see if you can get away with bombers to snipe fabs.
• First non-mex thing you need to build outside your base entrance is turret and walls, not a 2nd radar. You don't need to know if he is coming there or not. You need to expect it in advance.
• Don't bunch up your dox like that in a ball. Look at how many of their shots miss brown's more spread out dox, and how browns dox basically miss none.
• Again didn't rescout brown's base to see if he was going to build air or not. You kept building hummingbirds instead of bombers which were a waste. If you do that, you should atleast get your hummingbirds to patrol around the equator so that you will have some scouting information of where his mex is for you to kill, and where he is attacking from.
• On Duat, you must attempt to secure the mex in atleast one of the 3 equatorial zones. What i mean by this is that at the very least, push only in one direction with all your units and cap all the metal in that direction. Commander pushing, turrets, and walls are your friends. You can protect your other 2 entrances with walls and turrets as well.
• When you attack into his triangle, like when you did against the t2 factory, go around both sides of the mountain to maximise your entry space and minimise your exposure to angles of fire like from ubercannon. You would have taken out the t2 factory if you had done this.
• Also try to attack from the other 2 sides with small groups at the same time. People will tend to try and deal with the big scary main group coming and forget about defending the other entrances.

General feedback:
After saturating your triangle mex, have at the forefront of your mind the next goal of securing one equatorial zone of metal while denying your opponent from trying to secure more than one. Every decision you make at this point should be subservient to this goal.

Don't blob your dox into assist balls because it's worse for you. Attack from multiple angles, and be more aggressive with scouting and skirmishing. Make use of bombers.

I hope you find this helpful! Goodluck!

Hmm

whenever I complain about something that causes me to lose, people call me a bitching wimp.


hmmmm

to be fair, yours can't be countered

What is happening here is something that happens every time the balance is changed and this thread is a very good thing. Every time there is a big change, good players start trying things out to see if they can find good strategies. Of course the best starting point is to pick a unit and build only that, because we basically have to learn the whole game over again after every patch. I think this is an example of how even a really good player like Kiwi can miss some little thing and come to the wrong conclusion, but I could easily be the one that is wrong here.

I love it when they go all out in dox. They're sooo tasty (said the bomber).

until it gets shot down


by dox

dox is what 45 metal each, and a bomber is what 200 or seomthing, bombers easy kill there metal worth,

ELODEA HAS SPOKEN!

Did You ever tried it sideways or from the back?

Yeah, if theres enough dox they prevail lel

Its very dependent on micro. Which is stupid