Communications..again.

Indeed, that's very possible.

Here's an example:
https://trello.com/b/EceUgtCL/ghost-roadmap

Very very very much so agree with this.

I read your post and it is wrong because the OP said that people reading Ubers anouncements would presume this because Uber doesnt communicate well. So his post about people wanting more information from Ubers announcements doesnt fall apart, even if it was true that he misinterpreted Ubers statement (we don't know if he did but you assume it and even by doing so dont have a point against the criticism of the poor information politics).

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Not targeted specifically at you:

People here in this thread point out that it is a great game and that Uber told us about all the delays. Well yes we know this, there is information on this forum. But just go to Amazon, look up the information about the game there, then go to Ubers website and read the news since release. If you do this you know nothing about offline mode being worked on! That is the whole point of this discussion about bad communication. People buying this game right now (or getting the game because they backed it) dont have an easy way to tell that the missing features are coming and because they dont know Uber they complain about these features, over and over again. Uber doesnt tell them (they dont ensure that retailers have the correct information and they dont post it in their news section nor in the kickstarter update) that these features are coming, so the game got bad reviews and a shitstorm for every update. This shows that people want to know, they want information about this and the information is lacking (some people here turn this problem into Uber not giving information because there are shitstorms but clearly the bad information politics was there first).

So what can be done now?
- Uber can stick to their policy and give little information at specific threads on this forum, not giving specific timelines. Most of the people wont even find these bits of information and if you pass it along, Uber has to hope their customers will trust them. Why should they when they didnt follow the developement of the game and never heard of Uber before buying the game?
- Uber could just tell everyone (kickstarter update, news section of their homepage, the retailers that sell their game) that offline mode is coming. People would still ask when (Uber could say they are working hard but they have difficulties so there is no timeline) but at least people would have some hope. And people for whom offline is a must-have feature could wait until they buy the game. Now they bought it and are disappointed and maybe they even returned the game...

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jendrykgaming was faster than me and is spot on with his questions about the missing information on Ubers homepage

There doesn't even need to be dates associated with it. Just kinda some info about what they're working on right now and how far along in the process things are.

Dudes, they are waiting for sales to drop down to a trickle, and then they'll release the server. It's obvious now. And it might even be a good business move, at least in the short term. As for the long term... The long term doesn't matter if you lack the resources to make it that far.

It's really not Uber's fault, or any other developer's, when they act in an underhanded manner like this. It is the fault of the playerbase, which understands less about business than I do about belly dancing.

Ask yourselves what would have happened if in the Kickstarter pitch Uber had asked for the 5 or 6 million which the game REALLY ended up costing, and told people that the server would only be released after sales had plummeted to a trickle.

The game wouldn't have been funded. Therefore, LIES are needed in order for the playerbase to fund anything decent, and that's why so many developers are lying. And they have my support in this 100%.

This community is made up of fanatics?

Thanks not really right, most people here are just past the initial stage of disappointment that others have expressed.


But this is beginning to feel like one of those "Its us vs them" things where you are either in the massively disappointed group or the fanatical supporter group, with the former claiming that if you aren't with them, you are a fanatic and are to be dismissed.

And this community could really, really do with not having a great schism because we are all independent people with our own thoughts.


Im not a moderator, but frankly the forum has being getting a little crusader vs jihad, mainly the bad connotations, and it's really getting tiring.

Thanks @Knub23 for pointing out (again) that it's got zero to do with assuming Uber can't do this or that. It's pretty clear that a certain impression is going out (Uber doesn't care about offline) and the evidence is overwhelming that many many players are coming off with that impression, and posting about it.

Uber can prevent that sort of thing almost completely by the way they publish news to their sites.

It's like Dice and Battlefield 4. They got smashed unmercifully at first because of the lack of quality in the netcode, and they tried going the 'we aren't talking about it' route. Result? They had to push pretty damn hard to get out of the rut of every single update having a string of 20 comments at the top going "Netcode?? Wtf DICE"

Now they've got a community test environment, regular patch updates, discussions about things they're working on for the current patch, and they spend like 4 lines in the release notes just saying "hey, this is what's on the plate for our next major update too". It makes for a much healthier environment.

Without reading the thread, just the OP...
Programmers and Artists do not work on the same things. Both however need work to keep making money.

The thing is, when people asked on reddit if they should buy PA because they love skirmish and AI play, but have a bad internet connection, people were all hunky dory about how they should buy this beautiful game and how they are going to have a great time.

But the thing is, they aren't, and I said that to a few people before I wised up once people threw out enough down votes and "buy PA comments" to the guy, who isn't going to get a great experience when they had a bad internet connection.



I love PA, but why did people disagree with me when I suggested waiting for offline mode before they should buy the game?

Why is that a bad thing? The AI is nice, but needs more work, and skirmish on a bad connection is only going to end in heartbreak, I know, it happened to me all the time before my new internet box came.


We should be civil, absolutely, but let's not beat around the bush when people ask about things that aren't in the game. They might be soon, but right now, as I write this, they aren't.

So really, why are people over there, and even here telling people to buy a product when it doesn't include the features they specifically ask for, but with the promise so soon?

Well, you highlighted two very good points. You do have a right to continue checking progress. You also should do your best to be patient and understanding.

I have no trouble doing both. I want to see several things as much as anyone. I still just doubt the "patience", "understanding", and "good intent" of some people after seeing some people obvious lack all three while discarding the creator as a failure.

Wait. You're ok with people you buy products from LYING to you? That's an incredibly poor and unhealthy attitude. The best consumer is an informed consumer.

PS: Lying to customers in most countries is illegal and doing so is punishable by law.

http://xkcd.com/1425/

And that is why its stupid to ask a programmer how long will it take.

Aside, Uber did decide by themselves what's good for them, and what they could do. On that premises they pledged as much money as they thought necessary to realise the core game, and got the budget to realise the stretched goals (It has been said clearly in the interview given to TotalBiscuit).

Despite that, they're changing the specifications of the product on the run, as they will.

We can't say that there is an evil client forcing them to do what they do not want to, or are unable to.

I am in no rush to see anything completed now, today or tomorrow. But of course if they promised A and one day will finally deliver B, that would give people reasons to complain and bitch. Same if they screwed it with the release. People bought this game and would like to play it in future.

I think you make confusion between customer and producer. The customer already manifested good intent buying the product. Now it's the producer that has to prove good intent delivering what has been promised. Or be transparent about what is working on and next steps are. It's in the Kickstater page, as you see.

Patient and understanding, yes, it's always a good attitude. But missing to demand for accountability from the producer/creator wouldn't be very smart, indeed. That would equal to give money away and not caring about the outcome.

On top of that, let me add this. How comes that only the customer has to be patient and understanding? Couldn't Uber (and fanboys in general) understand that lot of customers at this stage are deeply frustrated?

As far as i know they are the one who decide on what they're working. So hopefuly they can qualify what's in the "R&D" field and what's in the operational field...... And this is also why they are using agile methods. They could perfectly provide status about their "user stories".

I'm speaking in generalities.

And could this fully excuse them should they miss to deliver what they did promise in order to get funded?

I agree that we should be patient. But on the other hand, Uber could definitely do a better job in keeping us informed about what's next for PA. Therefore I believe that we are entitled to press Uber. Kindly, but firmly. Too many Early Access games failed. And many will follow the same destiny.

I repeat, it isn't that hard.
https://trello.com/b/EceUgtCL/ghost-roadmap

I agree. And I note that in their new Kickstarter they are asking for a lot more money, which is more evidence that they did not ouright lie in the first one.