My observations from playing a week ( balance change suggestions )

1. Game still has a lot of bugs that need to be worked up, specifically graphical ones and selection ones ( where you lose control and can only seemingly gain it back by leaving the game and then returning ). Oh and the unable to join game bug is perhaps the most annoying of all, needs to get fixed ASAP.
   
   
2. Game doesn't really seem to be that much more stable than SupCom at later game. 6 player games can end up being an absolute crawl, I'm not sure if this is due to someones slower computer or the game code just being unable to handle that many units.
   
   
3. Dox still seem to be way too versatile and the best t1 unit which is always a safe bet to go for. I propose they take away their ability to walk under water and cut their vision in by at least 50% to make them basically blind without radar limiting their ability to harass around the entire map unless they have radar or scout support. Also take away their ability to hit air units, it doesn't happen often but theres no reason they should be the best raider unit hands down and have some anti air to boot. t1 bombers are great at taking them out but a single AA vehicle can pretty much shut down bombers.
   
   
4. Grenaders still don't seem like the hard counter to dox that they were meant to be, I propose they increase the fire rate, damage, or area of effect by at least 20%
   
   
5. I think vehicles are balanced perfectly, especially how the only mobile AA is in the t1 factory thus requiring use of t1 vehicles throughout the game
   
   
6. Naval units are still utterly useless in their current state, they cost too much, move too slow, and don't hit hard enough. I suggest at least a 20% damage AND hp increase across the board to make them more viable and worth it to build.
   
   
7. Orbital units should have at least a 3-5 second delay when entering and leaving a planet to prevent commander transport back and forth abuse and super easy laser satellite commander snipes. I still think the satellite sniping should be an option, but it should be a bit harder than it currently is.
   
   
8. I do not think orbital anti nukes are necessary, one of the best uses of nukes is to use against massed jigs in a gas planet and even then it isn't that effective if they spread out the jigs.
   
   
9. T2 gunships need a bit of a boost, either 25% more hp or 25% more damage. At their current stats they aren't worth getting at all and a t2 bomber is way more effective in every way.
   
   
10. There definitely needs to be a 1 minute startup timer at least for the death ray catalyst laser and I think it would be neat if theres at least a 5 minute cool down after it fires. I think the death ray should be a win condition but not an instant one. I've played at least a dozen games where the it would have been interesting to see if the enemy team or myself was able to take out the catalyst in time. However as soon as its done the game is basically over in seconds. Just give it a 1 minute warm up time and a 5 minute cool down so it isn't an automatic instant win condition in 10 player planet maps. I think things will play out better and be more interesting.
    
    
11. I think radar towers need to have only 1 hp ( paper mache armor ) which would allow for more interesting harassment choices and require a player to have more then just 1 radar tower ( which would require more energy to power these towers ). Total annihilation actually had a very similar hp scheme for the radar towers, I don't remember if supreme commander did.
    
    
12. I think laser towers are perfect with their current stats, a lot of players claim they are too weak but surround them with walls and they become very powerful against direct fire units. Even then they can still easily be taken out with the t2 long range units. Everything should have a check and a balance. In one game I had just 3 T3 towers were able to kill 100+ t1 tanks as long as they were surrounded by walls, it was a pretty fun sight, a few artillery units could have shut down that setup though. I think walls are fine the way they are because they do have their counters.
    
    
13. The t2 tanks look too much like the t1 tanks. They should make them look more distinctive or beefier. I mean heck who remembers the beefy bulldog or Goliath from the TA days? Those tanks had some mass to them and it was easy to distinguish them from their smaller t1 counterparts.
    
    
14. I think just like with TA and SupCom a t2 pure air superiority fighter would be useful to have in the game and add another element of strategy needed.
    
    
15. There should definitely be a separate portal for air units or air units should be able to enter a portal in general to make them more useful. They are definitely not used as much in this game compared to supcom.

16. There needs to seriously be a select all orbital hotkey

Hi gabbsc2.

When you say losing control, do you mean when you're in a game and suddenly you can't move the map and mouse pointer? I get that issue but its always because I have the small Esc menu up on the left side plus a fabber build menu up at the same time. I have to Esc Esc out of them to get control back. Maybe you mean something else?

I agree, Naval is not doing it like it should. Speed is way to low when turning a large ship.

A one minute startup timer would be good. Would give players a chance/reminder to target the weapon and maybe avert a gg before getting obliterated.

Yeah, I notice that quite a few players dont use walls nearly as much as they could. Definitly help with laser towers and other point defence structures. I use walls for missile AA too. Gives the structures just a little longer to be useful before they are taken down.

Having air units able to enter teleporters would, if nothing else, be way cool. Especially if they could enter at the same time as ground units. Being as they are above ground. Instant anti bomber backup just where and when its needed.

-

The Grenaders, despite the name, is not a counter to Dox. Rather they are a counter to walls. Theirs curved firing ark shoots over walls.

I agree, although there is much more needed than a simple damage and health buff. Speed is a big issue. There is a mod by burntcustard that seems to be on the right track.

Agree, with this. Many of the T2 units could use some beefing up.

There used to be one. It was removed because it was causing no end of balance issues.

[/QUOTE]
There used to be one. It was removed because it was causing no end of balance issues.[/QUOTE]

If Supcom and TA can do a t2 air superiority right, how come this game can't?

Have you tried hitting F5 when you lost control as you put it. It refreshes the....web page, I guess, that the game runs off.

They had one, problem is it just simply replaces the t1 version. This however would be a good idea:

Cool Fighter Plane Name:

Stats - Identical to T1 Fighter whom's name I forget.
Cost - More
Extra Ability - Can travel to other worlds, simply issue a move order to another planet and the fighter will power up through the atmosphere, travel through space, plunge down into the atmosphere of the other planets and be free to sweep the enemy skies clear.

There used to be one. It was removed because it was causing no end of balance issues.[/QUOTE]

If Supcom and TA can do a t2 air superiority right, how come this game can't?[/QUOTE]

Because Uber was having troubles balancing it, also Air superiority fighters were not really balanced they were much better than regular fighters in SC, can't remember TA.

I have made a couple suggestions in the past: like a stealth fighter with same stats otherwise and more expensive. Or a fighter with a light aoe acting like weak, mobile flak, that moves slowly, etc...

There used to be one. It was removed because it was causing no end of balance issues.[/QUOTE]

If Supcom and TA can do a t2 air superiority right, how come this game can't?[/QUOTE]

They didn't do it right.

in the case of T-2 ASF Uber could make a long range Interceptor istead of the ASF that we have on FA

IMO air is balanced nigh-on perfectly (except the superfluous gunship). Big SupCom games were decided by who had the most ASF, and big TA games were decided by who had the most Hawks/Vamps.

I wouldn't be surprised if the hard restrictions on shooting between layers in SupCom were introduced mainly because the Hawk/Vamp in TA was an all-purpose kill-anything unit, the thinking being that if the fighter can't shoot ground that will solve the problem. But it didn't, because the ASF kill all the enemy fighters, and then the strat bombers are free to go and kill everything.

There's some other more subtle things that have been done to air (too subtle for me to tell you exactly what they are), but the main thing that has sorted it out once and for all is the removal of the top-end fighter. Seems so damn obvious in retrospect, but it was a very clever move.

I actually find Dox to be little match for equivalent metal in T1 tanks. The tanks are slower and can't defend themselves from air (you'll need to include missile trucks) but they aren't going to be stopped by Dox. I haven't looked at the numbers to figure out why this is but it's been pretty consistent. I only build Dox for raids now and leave the main fight to tanks. I think the balance between vehicles and bots is reasonable.

I agree gunships need something. More range might do it. They SHOULD be good against T1 swarms but they are too easily killed by modest amounts of AA (or Dox).

Regarding commander transport cheese, I've long argued that commanders should not be transportable. Make him use teleporters if he wants to move around. Wouldn't change the game that much except to eliminate the cheese potential.

Taking out the t2 air, was a smart move only because it made all other air units pointless. The best change to air was making the t2 bomber something unique, it's slow ponderous and nothing like the t1.

I disagree with this. The ability to transport the com means that you have a choice of options for planet expansion. If he was unable to be transported you would have to use either an orbital fabber (much slower and more expensive in the crucial early stages), or transport a bot/vehicle fabber (no defences so if the opponent has got there first you have no chance of establishing a beachhead).

Also the latest PTE has introduced an 3-second orbital cooldown which will stop com-bouncing (and SXX snipes). They've applied it across the board which I suspect may need to be changed for Avengers and maybe fabbers, but we'll have to see how it plays out.

If it's good enough for ssx and transports then it's good enough for every orbital unit.

What is your reasoning for that?

What is your reason against it?

Is it okay to instantly destroy things in orbit and instantly build teleporters to move ground forces thorugh but not okay to instantly destroy things on the ground or land troops from transports.

SXX can result in instant, undefendable snipes. Astraeus can bounce between planets, becoming undestroyable.

Avengers have a use as a surgical tool to break through defences, to allow a teleporter to be put down. If either of these units have a 3-second cooldown, it will make planetary imvasion even harder than it is now, and most people seem of the opinion that turtling a planet is too strong already.

That's where you are incorrect, controlling the ground is far too ******* easy, controlling the orbital layer is balls to the walls a ******* hopeless endeavour.

Not sure I'm understanding what you mean here. It's my experience that once a player is entrenched on a planet (controlling the ground layer?) it's very hard for anybody to break through. Their only real hope is to do a teleport invasion, and with that knowledge it means that the person controlling the planet will put all their efforts into orbital defence.

Therefore anything that weakens an invading orbital force will only make it harder to crack a turtled-up planet, therefore the chance to pull back a victory from a weakened position are reduced, therefore the game becomes more binary and less fun.

If i must repeat myself defending on the planet against stuff other players attempt to place there, is simple. Controlling the orbital layer, where stuff just randomly appears with no counter is a nightmare. Cooldown for all op stuff is nice.

You think the attacker is in a worse position?

It takes him 3 seconds to assemble his forces (the cooldown) it can take up to a minute for the defender to rearrange his orbital forces to combat the invading force.

I would say that attacking a planet is generally harder than defending it, yes. Are you usually this angry, or are you having a bad day?